Bf-109 with Griffon?? - Printable Version

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+--- Thread: Bf-109 with Griffon?? (/showthread.php?tid=60858)

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Bf-109 with Griffon?? - 3dwa21 - 16.04.2009

Hello guys. I'm wrong or has that 109 a Griffon engine??




3dwa21

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- Guest - 16.04.2009

Thats a Merlin engine. The 109's DB605 engine was inverted so when the Spanish put the Merlin engine in the 109 airframe (becuase of a lack of DB605's) the cylinder's were too large ( hence the buldges.) I beleive the designation for that aircraft is a Hispano HA-112 Buchon

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- HH_Cipher - 16.04.2009

That hasn't got the Griffin.

I think that version of the 109 has the Hispano engine looks very similar to the Griffin yes. But remember the Griffin had soo much torque it needed 5 props not 4 or 3. which this mark has 3 bladed prop.

Taken at Lydd airshow 07:

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- Guest - 16.04.2009

Hispano Aviacion HA-1112. Licenced-built Bf-109 made in Spain. Since they had no Db-605s, they were modified to use Hispano-Suiza engines and Merlins. Many were later bought by museums and painted to look like German 109s. They also were used in the movie 'Battle of Britain'

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- TUCKIE_JG52 - 16.04.2009

Totally true. Since it was retired from active duty as late as 1963, there still alive some pilots that took part both in active squadrons and in the movie "Battle of Britain". I had the honour to met the guy that made an attacking pass at 1m above the ground in the first minutes of the movie:











More pictures of the recording of the movie here:
http://www.jaon.es/batallainglaterra/ba ... aterra.htm


Fore more info, I showed Il-2 to another of those pilots. He told that the flaps lasted one entire minute for complete their extension, since the wheel that actuates them (below left on the cockpit) use to be hard to move and there were remains of oil on it.

He also reported that their Merlins were limited to 1400 Cv for better engine endurance, but in the throttle there was a point that, if it was needed more power, it just had to be pushed forward, and then they got 1600 Cv.

There were a lot of accidents, and there's a false myth that most of them they were caused by the unstable thing that propeller rotated towards the inverse direction than the german one. In fact, Willy Messerschmitt itself helped to redesign fuselage and rudder to correct adverse effects of this.

There were also a known pilot, Messeger, that was famous by surviving many accidents. He crashed 3 in the same day. It's a popular thing told from mouth to mouth, that "Messerschmitt los construye y Messeguer los destruye" ("Messerschmitt builds and Messeguer destroys")

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- VonBarb. - 16.04.2009

The jacket he's wearing... I want one hock:

Cheers

Nico

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- Kosmos - 16.04.2009

Red 1 while with Real Aero at Breighton in 06.
Would be nice to see her in authentic Spanish colours for a change.

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- Metatron - 16.04.2009

PorcoRosso Wrote:The jacket he's wearing... I want one hock:

You'd get some looks for the swastika. It's just a symbol, but people have an amazing ability to associate things with nasty memories. :lol:

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- max_thehitman - 17.04.2009

That is totally wrong!! Why burn a great spitfire?
Unless it was completely made out of wood.

Me-109

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- TUCKIE_JG52 - 17.04.2009

Well, first of all, that burning Spit is not a real one, it was only atrezzo for the movie

Kosmos Wrote:Red 1 while with Real Aero at Breighton in 06.
Would be nice to see her in authentic Spanish colours for a change.

As you wish:

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- Phas3e - 17.04.2009

max_thehitman Wrote:That is totally wrong!! Why burn a great spitfire?
Unless it was completely made out of wood.

They struggled to get enough spits in the first place, none of the aircraft seen destroyed in the movie
were real ones, most were replicas on the ground or RC models

Although the hanger blown up was a Battle of Britain era Hanger, its loss is quite a sharp one to swallow these days.

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- MrGoldfinger - 17.05.2009

TUCKIE_JG52 Wrote:Well, first of all, that burning Spit is not a real one, it was only atrezzo for the movie

Kosmos Wrote:Red 1 while with Real Aero at Breighton in 06.
Would be nice to see her in authentic Spanish colours for a change.

As you wish:

The skins are still existing, somewhere at flying-legends

- but what more interesting is; A Ha 1112 Buchon and offcourse - a CASA C.2111...

(btw. cool photo, did you have moreof this?)

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- RAF_Leigh - 17.05.2009

HH_Cipher Wrote:But remember the Griffin had soo much torque it needed 5 props not 4 or 3.

I believe you are wrong sir

The CA-15 The fastest piston plane EVER with speeds of 803km/h had a Griffon with 4 props

sorry but i can have 4 props not only limited to 5

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- Guest - 17.05.2009

RAF_Leigh Wrote:

HH_Cipher Wrote:But remember the Griffin had soo much torque it needed 5 props not 4 or 3.

I believe you are wrong sir

The CA-15 The fastest piston plane EVER with speeds of 803km/h had a Griffon with 4 props

sorry but i can have 4 props not only limited to 5

The Seafire XVII and Spitfire XII are griffon powered with 4 blade props.

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- caldrail - 17.05.2009

The Buchon used a Hispano Suiza engine instead of the DB605 until 1954 when the Merlin was fitted.

According to display pilots, the Buchon (Merlin version) is quite a fast aeroplane, easily accelerating past spitfires.

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