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WHAT do you think about SPIT XII and SPIT XIV FM. - Printable Version

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+---- Thread: WHAT do you think about SPIT XII and SPIT XIV FM. (/showthread.php?tid=65991)

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Re: spit 14 - Karaya - 26.10.2009

peteeat Wrote:ive been listening to post's with intrest about the spit 14 and to my knowledge the spit14 s turn was excactly the same as the mk9 infact at all height's it was superior in every facet

That is simply impossible, you cannot put 500+ kg onto an aircraft and still have it turn like nothing happened. Stall speed will increase noticeably, as will the speed of the fastest turn, so in short the Mk.IX WILL outturn the XIV, especially at low speeds. However with the added power of the Griffon it is possible that the XIV is better at turning at higher speeds, as the brute force of the Griffon will pull the aircraft through turns.

- peteeat - 26.10.2009

u can off set that with extra power the spit wing had a very generous stall envelope their was more torgue pull due to the griffon engine , and dont take my word for it the rae tested the 9 and 14 thoroughly
the 14 was surperior in every other category and EQUAL in turn with the mk9 in my view the best all round interceptor of ww2

- JV69_BADA - 26.10.2009

AMK Wrote:LOL..

It is considered that when used below 20,000 feet it will be able to out-pace, out-turn and roll as well as the FW.190. The general manoeuvrability for dog-fighting is slightly limited by the fact that the engine cuts under negative acceleration forces. "

I think author FM for Spit XII, XIV make jokes build FM like this Wink I took about manoeuvrability.

LoL :roll:

spit mk14 - peteeat - 26.10.2009

enjoyhttp://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarc ... 01604.html
the link above gives a quite detailed test flight in the mk14 by eric brown in 1945 as you will find he was very impressed by the 14's climb/turn and speed

spit 14 - peteeat - 26.10.2009

www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/19 ... 01604.html
my apoligies wrong link

spit mk14 - peteeat - 26.10.2009

ehttp://www.spitfireperformance.com/spit14afdu.html



heres a good comparison of the mk14 and mk9

And this is what Jeff Ethell writes: - FENRIR - 26.10.2009

Quote:While the Merlin-engine versions run very smoothly, the larger Griffon-engine machines feel as if they are angry. The sound from the exhaust stacks and the vibration transferred to the seat of the pants communicates visceral power, almost a desire to go kill something. Any hot-rod lover would enjoy this sensation of unbridled horsepower, this impatience to be turned loose and hunt. Every fighter I've been in is great fun to fly but only a very few are brutally straight about why they exist. The Griffon Spitfire is one such machine.

With enough warmth in the coolant and oil, a flip of the parking brake catch releases the brake lever on the spade control grip and the aircraft is taxiing with minimal power. The first time I had the opportunity to fly a British aircraft with this hand operated air brake system I was skeptical about it being very effective compared to hydraulic toe brakes. Within a very few minutes I was completely won over. It is far easier to manage, particularly on run up when one has to really stand on most American fighter rudder pedals. The source of high-pressure air is controlled by the brake lever on the spade control grip, or stick. The rudder pedals modulate the distribution of pressure to the left and right main wheel brakes. If the pedals are even, equal braking is applied to both sides; as one rudder pedal is applied then more brake pressure is fed to that side. Strength of application is delivered by the hand lever on the grip. The major benefit to all this is having one's feet and legs almost completely relaxed most of the time.

Lining up for take-off is intimidating with that Rolls-Royce engine sticking way out in front. There is no sense in thinking too much about it. Throttle up slowly to prevent a lurch to the right (if in a Griffon Spit where the propeller turns the opposite direction from American aircraft)...left foot moves forward almost in concert with the left hand to keep the nose straight. Monster torque shoves the right wing down rapidly, very much like the P-40, until full left aileron and full (give or take a minuscule amount) left rudder is held. The Rolls is a wounded dragon bellowing horrendously.

There is so much raw power and noise, and you are so tightly focused on keeping everything under control, the actual lift-off at around 90 kts goes by almost unnoticed. Switch hands, move the gear lever down to disengage it from the slot, inwards through the gate and then smartly all the way forward, hold momentarily, then let go. If all is well, the lever snaps outwards through the upper gate, then springs back into the upper slot. Its easy to spot a new Spitfire pilot...the aircraft porpoises as the pilot changes hands and works the gear lever.

Sitting behind this demon V-12 churning out so much power is intoxicating...the earth falls away at a rapid rate, at least for something with a propeller. A look around reveals the excellent visibility out of the bubble canopy. This lessens, to a degree, the impression of being buried within a Spitfire, though that feeling of being a part of the machine does not change. The elevator is very light while the rudder is stiff and the ailerons even more so. Every Spitfire I've flown takes a bit more muscle to roll than most fighters. As speed increases both rudder and ailerons get heavier, resulting in a curious mismatch at high speed...one has to handle the almost oversensitive elevators with a light fingertip touch while arm-wrestling the stiff ailerons. Pilots had to keep this in mind during combat, particularly when going against the Fw 190 which had a sterling rate of roll and exceptionally well harmonized controls. That being said, the aircraft is very well balanced and delightful to maneuver. Whipping a Spit around the clouds ranks right up there at the top of aviation's great experiences.

The aircraft stalls like a Piper Cub. Though a wing tends to drop, there isn't the slightest mean streak in it unless you cob the power, which produces a very violent torque roll. Power off, gear and flaps down, main fuel tanks full, it stalls at 65 kts, which is ridiculously slow. Add a slight bit of power and that drops to 60 kts. With that enormous snout, I try to make a curving approach to landing at about 100 kts in order to keep the runway in sight as long as possible. By the time I'm rolling out across the field boundary, if at max landing weight, I should be no faster than 85 kts with power and 95 kts in a glide. At lighter weights these speeds can be reduced by 5 kts.

All Spitfires are exceptionally easy to land with no inherent tendency to swerve or groundloop. Just reduce power to idle, flare to a three point attitude and she sets down on a feather almost every time. This is a great surprise to most considering the narrow track undercarriage and full swivel, non-locking tailwheel. Why doesn't it drop a wing violently or make the pilot stomp on the rudders? I wish I knew. The genius of managing to combine light aircraft characteristics with such high performance is nothing short of miraculous compared to most other wartime tailwheel types. One or two landings in the Spitfire and you are in love for life.

I think the FM designer has got it pretty close generally - however, landing the XIV or XII as modelled in this game is NOTHING like how he describes. Trying to get the XII back on terra firma is downright tewrrifying. It' s pig!

ALso I think the effect of torque on roll whilst flying is too emphasised - without trim i'm often cross contolled (i.e rudder left, aileron right) and quite generously. These aspects would IMHO need attention.