[gibbage]

I know im going to cause some waves here, but im getting a little peeved by all the attention Luftwaffe 1946 "paper" airplanes are getting. Why is it that the Luft-46 stuff gets so much attention? It seems that they have a very big fanbase, but why? Why not other country's? The US drew up stuff that was just as outlandish and fantastic as anything the Germans came up with, and a lot of the US stuff FLEW, unlike the German counterparts.

Here is a few examples.

Lockheed L-133



Designed in 1939!!!!! Lockheed proposed not only building the fighter, but the jet engines. Designed by Kelly Johnson, who designed the P-38 and SR-71 later, so he knew a thing or two about aircraft. Would of been the first jet fighter if the US Gov. didnt have there head up there.... You get the idea.

Northrop B-35.



Design started in 1939!!!! N1M first flew in 1941 to test out powered flying wings and controles. N9M was a 1/3 scale prototype of the bomber, flew in Dec 1942. By then, the US had confidence that Britin would not fall, and cancled funding of the B-35 program. The B-35 was designed to fly from the US, and hit targets in GERMANY (Americabomber? Pish posh!) and fly back in case Britin was invaded and fell. Top speed of almost 400MPH!!! 16 defensive guns! 50,000lb of bombs. This thing FLEW!! Northrop contenued development using its own funding, but development was very slow. If the US had backed it, it could of seen combat in WWII.

Northrop B-49.



Same aircraft as the B-35, but with jets.



Curtis P-55 Ascender. Flew in 1943, designed in 1939-1940. Note the SWEPT WING, before the Me-262. Plagued by its engine (non-supercharged Allison) when the engine it was designed for didnt pan out (Pratt & Whitney X-1800 engine), so it was missing almost 800HP. Due to this, it was very under-powered. Just think of a Merlin back there pumping 1650HP instead of 1000.

Northrop XP-56.



Again, note the swept wing. Flew by 1943. Another aircraft that was intended to get the PW X-1800 rated at 1800HP, but got a PW Radial istead. Rated speed was almost 460MPH. Testing proved difficult, and it didnt achieve desired speeds.

Valtee XP-54.



Flew in 1943. Again, plagued by the cancellation of the X-1800. Very cool looking aircraft, I think!

Douglas B-42.



This is the interesting one, I think. Powered by two Allison V-1710's housed in the body, for aerodynamics, and pushed by counter-rotating propellers. This MEDIUM BOMBER set a speed record of 433MPH from Long Beach to Washington DC in 1944!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, thats a MEDIUM BOMBER flyings FASTER then MOST fighters of the time! It had twin remote 50 cal turrets that came out of the wings for defense, and could carry 8000lb of bombs. The Germans would of had FITS trying to shoot this thing down in 109's or 190's!!! They had a hard time with the Mossy as it was.

Im not asking for these aircraft to be modeled. Im just trying to figure why so many people are so obsessed with German fantisy aircraft, with other country's had stuff as equally impressive. Why no love for the X-planes?

[Guest]

I know im going to cause some waves here, but im getting a little peeved by all the attention Luftwaffe 1946 "paper" airplanes are getting. Why is it that the Luft-46 stuff gets so much attention? It seems that they have a very big fanbase, but why? Why not other country's? The US drew up stuff that was just as outlandish and fantastic as anything the Germans came up with, and a lot of the US stuff FLEW, unlike the German counterparts.

Here is a few examples.

Lockheed L-133



Designed in 1939!!!!! Lockheed proposed not only building the fighter, but the jet engines. Designed by Kelly Johnson, who designed the P-38 and SR-71 later, so he knew a thing or two about aircraft. Would of been the first jet fighter if the US Gov. didnt have there head up there.... You get the idea.

Northrop B-35.



Design started in 1939!!!! N1M first flew in 1941 to test out powered flying wings and controles. N9M was a 1/3 scale prototype of the bomber, flew in Dec 1942. By then, the US had confidence that Britin would not fall, and cancled funding of the B-35 program. The B-35 was designed to fly from the US, and hit targets in GERMANY (Americabomber? Pish posh!) and fly back in case Britin was invaded and fell. Top speed of almost 400MPH!!! 16 defensive guns! 50,000lb of bombs. This thing FLEW!! Northrop contenued development using its own funding, but development was very slow. If the US had backed it, it could of seen combat in WWII.

Northrop B-49.



Same aircraft as the B-35, but with jets.



Curtis P-55 Ascender. Flew in 1943, designed in 1939-1940. Note the SWEPT WING, before the Me-262. Plagued by its engine (non-supercharged Allison) when the engine it was designed for didnt pan out (Pratt & Whitney X-1800 engine), so it was missing almost 800HP. Due to this, it was very under-powered. Just think of a Merlin back there pumping 1650HP instead of 1000.

Northrop XP-56.



Again, note the swept wing. Flew by 1943. Another aircraft that was intended to get the PW X-1800 rated at 1800HP, but got a PW Radial istead. Rated speed was almost 460MPH. Testing proved difficult, and it didnt achieve desired speeds.

Valtee XP-54.



Flew in 1943. Again, plagued by the cancellation of the X-1800. Very cool looking aircraft, I think!

Douglas B-42.



This is the interesting one, I think. Powered by two Allison V-1710's housed in the body, for aerodynamics, and pushed by counter-rotating propellers. This MEDIUM BOMBER set a speed record of 433MPH from Long Beach to Washington DC in 1944!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, thats a MEDIUM BOMBER flyings FASTER then MOST fighters of the time! It had twin remote 50 cal turrets that came out of the wings for defense, and could carry 8000lb of bombs. The Germans would of had FITS trying to shoot this thing down in 109's or 190's!!! They had a hard time with the Mossy as it was.

Im not asking for these aircraft to be modeled. Im just trying to figure why so many people are so obsessed with German fantisy aircraft, with other country's had stuff as equally impressive. Why no love for the X-planes?

you sure that wing was started in 39? Looks like a Gotha ripoff. even the cockpit.

[Jaypack44]

I agree. I'm a big fan of the XP-55, it was one of my favorite planes to fly in CFS3. First, I'd like to see more actual WWII a/c in game, especially Japanese, but the US did have some pretty neat experimental designs...

[gibbage]

you sure that wing was started in 39? Looks like a Gotha ripoff. even the cockpit.

First, can you please edit your question and not quote EVERYTHING?

Second, Jack Northrop and the Horton Brothers designed there aircraft without any knoledge of each others work till AFTER WWII, when Jack inspected alot of the Horton Brothers designs. There approach is VERY different, with the only common feature's being the fact that they are flying wings.

The biggest difference between the two designs was that Jack Northrop used vents and split ailerons to controle pitch, yaw and roll. The Horton brothers used Elevons, and air brakes.

A lot of people say the B-2 is a development of the Horten design, but as I said in another thread, the B-2 uses 0 design features from the Go-229. It has the same wings span (175 feet) and control system (split aileron) of the B-35. Even had the same number of engines, 4.

Gib

[Chaoic16]

Gibbage,

I have many of Allied experimental and 'what if' aircraft requests library at viewtopic.php?t=7790. If you want to have any more of 1946s of allied you'd like to see in 1946, please post your requests them at my threads, just in case you haven't seen my aircraft requests library with informaiton/data/background/blueprint/sources at (The link is inoperative).




Chaoic out...

[Guest]

you sure that wing was started in 39? Looks like a Gotha ripoff. even the cockpit.

First, can you please edit your question and not quote EVERYTHING?

Second, Jack Northrop and the Horton Brothers designed there aircraft without any knoledge of each others work till AFTER WWII, when Jack inspected alot of the Horton Brothers designs. There approach is VERY different, with the only common feature's being the fact that they are flying wings.

The biggest difference between the two designs was that Jack Northrop used vents and split ailerons to controle pitch, yaw and roll. The Horton brothers used Elevons, and air brakes.

A lot of people say the B-2 is a development of the Horten design, but as I said in another thread, the B-2 uses 0 design features from the Go-229. It has the same wings span (175 feet) and control system (split aileron) of the B-35. Even had the same number of engines, 4.

Gib

oh nonsense. and a lot of people are right. Did that thing even fly or is that picture just doctored?

[Cobra84]

Did that thing even fly or is that picture just doctored?

It flew, as did a jet powered version a year later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_YB-35
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_YB-49

[Chaoic16]

struwwelpeter,

YB-35 (propeller version) and YB-49 (jet version) actually existed and flew. Here is videos on these experimental bombers that US have done with these giant flyng wings:

YB-35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAj-ECF3 ... re=related (starting at 6:20, you'll see YB-35 engine starting then take off)

YB-49
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwgqYUoWCTg

After doing research on what gibbage have claimed about Northrop first flying wing in 1939. It appears that the information that gibbage stated is accurate. Here is sources on N-1, Northrop first flying wing:

http://www.century-of-flight.net/Aviati ... rthrop.htm

Photo:

http://www.aviation-history.com/garber/ ... M-1_f.html
http://www.aviation-history.com/garber/ ... M-2_f.html
http://www.aviation-history.com/garber/ ... M-3_f.html

Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Uk7zyR0PF8


Chaoic out...

[American]

I really like these allied experimental AC. But the truth is it would take MONTHs to get these planes in the game. Also we would never be able to get accurate FM. The only reason why I might push for these AC is to counter olegs Russian and german 46 Planes

[Chaoic16]

I really like these allied experimental AC. But the truth is it would take MONTHs to get these planes in the game. Also we would never be able to get accurate FM. The only reason why I might push for these AC is to counter olegs Russian and german 46 Planes

Never? Actually that is not true, there are alway way find 'predicted' FM, check my theory on getting best predicted FM for any experimental and 'what if' aircraft at viewtopic.php?t=7634. Besides No simulation are ever 100 percent accurate in FM, what counts is getting FM that are as close to accurate FM as possible. However, AAA modders already are adding luftwaffe 'what if' planes, so, I agree with you and gibbage about adding US 1946 aircrafts to encounter axis experimental and 'what if' aircraft.


Chaoic out...

[gibbage]

I really like these allied experimental AC. But the truth is it would take MONTHs to get these planes in the game. Also we would never be able to get accurate FM. The only reason why I might push for these AC is to counter olegs Russian and german 46 Planes

How did Oleg model the Learch or Ta-183? Those never flew, along with the full production Go-229 for that matter.

There are ways.

[Zorin]

The Horton Ho V (powered flying wing) first flew in 1936 (100% synthetic materials (high-tech for the mid 30s)) with a second altered design taking to air in 1937. Besides, the Horton brothers were already known for their flying wing gliders in the 30s, so claiming that Mr. Johnson wasn't aware of what was going on over the pond is pretty naive.

[shakthamac]

oh nonsense. and a lot of people are right. Did that thing even fly or is that picture just doctored?

Pathetic. Your simplistic historical thoughts are telling.

All of these designs flew, unlike this BS fantasy Luft-crap we have in game now. And most did it BEFORE 1945. Quite frankly, I'm sick and tired of everyone downplaying US / British technological innovation in WW2. The Germans were smart, but they weren't the only ones.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I agree with the majority here.
We got what? Only the P-80? Come on, folks! The P-80!
So that's like, what?
A ratio of 1:10 US vs. Nazi UFOs & other assorted junk.
:x :x :x

Personally, I would love to see that one ramming concept (at a loss for any sort of designation) we had. Hmm... only wikipedia can solve this!

At least the Gloster is being worked on - that actually flew during the war (just wasn't allowed to fly near the front lines for obvious reasons). Great example of British jet technology.

It'll be a long road to travel, though. Let's see if we lose interest in this matter once we have the Whirlwind!

[Spartan10590]

They were smart and had a lot of innovative ideas which have found their way into modern technology and beyond.

The only problem was that, for the most part, by the time Germany was able to build workable prototypes, the resources simply were not available to sustain several advanced and high requirement projects at once; which is exactly what was attempted.

I do find these German prototypes quite fascinating and I really love being able to fly them, but I have to agree; the Allied projects need some love.