Somebody had too much beer last night? - Printable Version
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- fabianfred - 31.01.2008
I presume these larger ships are both static and moving..??
would a larger carrier still allow flight operations as normal??
- spud - 31.01.2008
I recently reposted this someplece, but if anythign the carriers are too big. If so, not by much. I have screenshots of planes on deck, then I cut them out in PS and arranged them like a real image of an Essex I have, and it's just about spot on (SBDs at the rear of the deck, alternating rows of 2 and 3).
BTW, all we need to do with the scaled up tankker is a different skin with smaller windows, etc.
tater
- spud - 01.02.2008
In the Hier.him there are entries like:
[Hull2]
Mesh Hull2
Parent _ROOT_
Attaching 0 1 0 -1 0 0 0 0 1 -0.0157892 2.38e-008 0.228566
In pilot scale, the first number after attaching was 1, and changing it to 0.95 made 95%, and so on.
The first number here is a 0. Presumably you need to change ALL of them, or most anyway (the boats should stay the same).
Strikes me that the Mast_N and Mast T (and maybe some wires) could be pointed to by the merchant ship, then we'd have a merchant with goalposts. If that was scaled up in size, it might make it look less like a scaled up version.
tater
- FC - 02.02.2008
I started to open new slots for ships. That's the easy part, making new ships it's harder. But before I open new slots we need to reach some sort of agreement which ships should be added. That's important because I need to hardcode few things and you, ship makers, will have to use these names during building. Here is my list of ships, this is not carved in stone and it can be changed.
1.Tanker0
2.Tanker1
3.Tanker2
4.Destroyer0
5.Destroyer1
6.Destroyer2
7.Cruiser0
8.Cruiser1
9.Cruiser2
10.Battleship0
11.Battleship1
12.Battleship2
13.Carrier0
14.Carrier1
15.Carrier2
16.Carrier3
17.Transport0
18.Transport1
19.Transport2
20.Transport3
21.TransWreck
22.TankerWreck
To clone ship or to make new one (that's just cloning with resizing, adding or deleting parts of Ship) you need to make folder with ship name in 3DO/Ships folder, for Tanker0 that would be 3DO/Ships/Tanker0. As you are making tanker than it would be logical to use existing tanker as base so you should copy your extracted Tanker SFS files into 3DO/Ship folder.
So you will have two folders there 3DO/Ships/Tanker0, that one is empty and 3DO/Ships/Tanker with original tanker files.
Now you are ready to work on tanker, change skin, and work with hier.him file to add, delete or resize parts of the ship. To see what you have done you will open FMB and use tanker(It's FMB name is Liquid Cargo Carrier IIRC).
In addition you will have to make changes in 2 or 3 other files depending on armament of the ship.
These files are Ships.ini, Chief.ini and Technics.ini . Technics.ini is not necessary if there is no guns on ship.
Simplest way to do that is to find your basic ship (Tanker in this example) and copy all that goes with it and change names into Tanker0.
When this is finished and you are satisfied with your ship, move content of 3DO/Ships/Tanker to 3DO/Ships/Tanker0. You will now have your Tanker0 visible in FMB but you will not have it in mission, that's what I have to do.
As I don't want to add new ships or change their code names every day I would like you to decide now entries for first group of ships.
To change and resize ships you need to work with hier.him files, there are some numbers there which are used as modifiers of 3D model. I'll make tutorial with explanation what is function of these numbers but you can experiment on your own too, it's always satisfying to figure out things without help.
You can also ask Mr.Jolly or Ranwers, they are experienced in working with Hiers when they are making planes and they know it much better than me.
What I said for ships apply for other objects too, tanks ,vehicles etc. they can be added in game too.
FC
- FltLt HardBall - 02.02.2008
How about a DestroyerWreck and a SmallShipWreck (something like a minesweeper or corvette)?
- FC - 02.02.2008
FltLt HardBall Wrote:How about a DestroyerWreck and a SmallShipWreck (something like a minesweeper or corvette)?
Sure, why not. I'm not expert for ships so it's all on community. Like I said, hard and time consuming part is to make ships not to code them in game.
FC
- spud - 02.02.2008
One wreck should be a merchant ship, most of the SWPA wrecks were merchants.
I'm fine with the names, though for the DDs, would they all be the same? The DDs are pretty country specific in appearance. There is one DD, the 4 stacker Wilkes Class, that was used by the USN and RN (lend lease). One of them, ex-USS Stewart became an IJN Patrol Boat (PB-102).
tater
- duffys tavern - 02.02.2008
Perhaps an "Essex" class CV without deck numbers. That way it could be any the "Essex" class. We have may F4Us & F6Fs skinned for other carriers. Maybe CVE without deck numbers as well, for same reason. Perhaps a CVE with RN flag. Maybe, if like you say, parts are like "Lego blocks" maybe a CVE without the island, simular to the Long Island class. Wow!
- VT-51_Razor - 02.02.2008
"To change and resize ships you need to work with hier.him files, there are some numbers there which are used as modifiers of 3D model. I'll make tutorial with explanation what is function of these numbers but you can experiment on your own too, it's always satisfying to figure out things without help. "
FC, are you referring to Static ships here? Is it possible to do this to CVs that are usable by aircraft? If so, this would be HUGE!! The CVLs were only about 40-50 feet longer than the CVEs, but the CVEs were about 8-9 feet wider. It would be awesome to see a closer approximation of the Independance class CVLs in the game.
- JV69_BADA - 02.02.2008
about adding ships:
"IF" my memory is still intact:
some destroyers ,cruisers and carriers were re-armed through the war, adding guns,dca.
Maybe it would be a nice thing to have a begin war essex and a end-war essex (it's just an exemple, i don't know clue about ships :oops: ), but then it should be historicly checked by someone :wink: .
- FC - 02.02.2008
spud Wrote:One wreck should be a merchant ship, most of the SWPA wrecks were merchants.
I'm fine with the names, though for the DDs, would they all be the same? The DDs are pretty country specific in appearance. There is one DD, the 4 stacker Wilkes Class, that was used by the USN and RN (lend lease). One of them, ex-USS Stewart became an IJN Patrol Boat (PB-102).
tater
It's up to ship maker to make ships the way he wants, my coding doesn't have anything to do with properties of ship but it would be stupid to use Tanker under the Carrier name.
My idea is that we should make some sort of agreement and than build these ships to create some sort of Ship Pack.
duffys tavern Wrote:Perhaps an "Essex" class CV without deck numbers. That way it could be any the "Essex" class. We have may F4Us & F6Fs skinned for other carriers. Maybe CVE without deck numbers as well, for same reason. Perhaps a CVE with RN flag. Maybe, if like you say, parts are like "Lego blocks" maybe a CVE without the island, simular to the Long Island class. Wow!
No problem at all, I believe that deck number is just a matter of skin and from my limited experimenting with Lexington class it seems that it would be possible to remove island, I suppose that other carriers are build same way.
VT-51_Razor Wrote:"To change and resize ships you need to work with hier.him files, there are some numbers there which are used as modifiers of 3D model. I'll make tutorial with explanation what is function of these numbers but you can experiment on your own too, it's always satisfying to figure out things without help. "
FC, are you referring to Static ships here? Is it possible to do this to CVs that are usable by aircraft? If so, this would be HUGE!! The CVLs were only about 40-50 feet longer than the CVEs, but the CVEs were about 8-9 feet wider. It would be awesome to see a closer approximation of the Independance class CVLs in the game.
I'm talking about movable ships, I didn't try to resize carriers and land there but I don't think that there should be a problems.
Here is updated list of ships and my suggestions what to do with some of them.
1.Tanker0-Same as standard but with different skin (vpmedia for example)
2.Tanker1-Upscaled standard and new skin
3.Tanker2-Even bigger, new skin
4.Destroyer0
5.Destroyer1
6.Destroyer2
7.Cruiser0
8.Cruiser1
9.Cruiser2
10.Battleship0
11.Battleship1
12.Battleship2
13.Carrier0
14.Carrier1
15.Carrier2
16.Carrier3
17.Transport0-Same as standard, different skin
18.Transport1-different size and skin
19.Transport2- different size and skin
20.Transport3-different size and skin
21.TransWreck- Ship with a list on one side, weakened damage model
22.TankerWreck -Same as above
23.DestroyerWreck-Same as above
24.SmallShipWreck-Same as above
25.SmallFishermenBoat-small boat with fisherman inside
NOTE: Wrecks can be with reduced damage model to simulate damaged ships that are still able float, drawback is that in this case they can sunk if hit. For total wrecks, ships have to be indestructible so they will never sunk.
Feel free to fill and correct this list.
FC
- spud - 02.02.2008
I agree on indestructible for wrecks. Honestly, with the damaged ships, I'd not change the DM. Ships are ridiculously easy to sink in IL-2, making the damage ships easier would just mean the first plane to look at it funny would sink it.
Just IMHO.
- duffys tavern - 02.02.2008
spud Wrote:I agree on indestructible for wrecks. Honestly, with the damaged ships, I'd not change the DM. Ships are ridiculously easy to sink in IL-2, making the damage ships easier would just mean the first plane to look at it funny would sink it.
Just IMHO.
Yes, damaged ships would add so much and I agree they should be indestructible. Those building could add smoke & fire, if they desire. Man, this is great!
- VT-51_Razor - 02.02.2008
That is great news FC. I wish I could contribute to this effort, but I am hopeless when it comes to this sort of thing. :oops: However, I could provide some pictures and/or drawings or statistics for anyone interested in trying to stretch a CVE to make it into a CVL.
- duffys tavern - 02.02.2008
Year and years ago, someone made some very nice CVLs for CFS2, with lots of background info. Can't remember, for the life of me, who it was.
Found it! "Easykill" http://storage2.free.fr/