P-47 Thunderbolt cockpit modding references and discussion - Printable Version
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+--- Thread: P-47 Thunderbolt cockpit modding references and discussion (/showthread.php?tid=51680)
- FA_Diablo - 09.06.2008
chris455 Wrote:poncho Wrote:Chris,
We could put some wires etc. in that hole. That seems to be the most typical thing in most of the photos I have seen too. It is tempting to put a radio in there, but that would be wrong for the razorback. On another simmed version their solution was to put 2 pilot reference placards in that spot.
Another thing that has been bugging me all along is the large space between the instrument panel and the firewall in the Razorbacks. In the bubble canopy versions the space is much less. Is this accurate? It seems wrong.
Poncho
Hi Poncho,
I will check my references regarding the firewall / panel space and get back with you with something useful if I can
from the pic shown the space looks to be a little to big. Maybe it's jsut illusion.
- chris455 - 09.06.2008
Behold!
Best viewed on full screen.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=0447530&size=L
More, however, these appear to be bubbletops:
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled ... =&next_id=
More:
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Brazil%2 ... =&next_id=
http://www.airliners.net/photo/USA---Ai ... id=1137032
http://www.airliners.net/photo/USA---Ai ... id=0208472
- poncho - 09.06.2008
Taurus,
The behind the panel area appears to be on floor.tga (yellow/black banded area), do you have any ideas what could be done texture-wise in this area? You have seen the panel edging that I applied with transplanted mesh. When I saw how much area is left on the panel tga, I realized that you could perhaps get the same effect just with texturing the panel tga. If you could that would be great as it would fit the contours better, and save mesh.
Regarding what I thought was too much space behind the D10 panel. Thanks Chris for putting up those links, the top down shots do show more space than the head ons would suggest, maybe Diablo was right about it just being the angle. At normal angles it actually looks OK. Sometimes if you look at areas too long you start to see too much.
Poncho
- SparrowThree - 09.06.2008
The original black / or dark green is correct IMO. From the images I have you would be able to see up to the back of the firewall if the lighting was just right. The opening in the IP that the sight arm comes through may be larger than necessary, but from the pilots perspective no instrument wiring is visible. There is a small gap between the back of the IP and the back of the wind screen.
The space immediately to the left of the sight would be partially obscured buy the back up ring & bead site and the clamps that hold it in place. I have some decent references but no scanner.
I do think there was a placard just to the left of the gun sight, it actually looks like a little metal lip that holds a small paper card. But I'm not sure on which marks.
If anything the whole cockpit sits a little low in the fuselage.
- chris455 - 10.06.2008
Quote:but from the pilots perspective no instrument wiring is visibleSparrow,
please refer to my links above, the photos do not bear out what you seem to be saying here.
As far as the pit sitting too low, the panel itself definitely is somewhat low, perhaps the whole thing as you say, although I'm not 100% certain.
As far as the dark area being correct "as is" I must respectfully disagree. The photos I have provided clearly show wiring, cabling, and other items that are in clear view of the pilot, since the photos were shot from that perspective.
Poncho, I am tending to agree with others now, and your most recent obsevation, that the space between panel and cowl is probably OK, although the basic shape of the plating which lies underneath the actual windshield is incorrect. It should take the form of a "hood" which arches over the panel, and on the razorbacks at least, seems to have had a square whole cut into it through which the gunsight protrudes. It is this "hood" effect that, from the pilot's perspective, minimizes the apparent size of what we have been referring to as the "dark area". I regret that I do not have an image of this phenomenon to show it plainly.
- taurus - 10.06.2008
Poncho,
You can see by the smearing of the yellow on the fore cockpit bulkhead that the background would have to be pretty indestinct, because a small texture part is used to cover such a large area. I was hoping to render that part like the floor as it is a verticle corrugation with detail around the gunsite. I will need to find what part of the floor.tga they used for that bulkhead. (Just like the fuse/switchbox - upper top left green bit!) The only option is to put a flat poly there and render on that. May be alot easier soon
Also bort.tga took care of the black cockpit sides.The top panel hood would be pretty difficult to get right using the panel.tga alone. Although the texture goes pretty high. I will look into it. Maybe another mesh to save the day? There are pitot and static lines feeding into the instruments that should be included as well.
Below are some razor reference for that panel top hood... The top left pic is an actual photo by a pilot at the time so it's as genuine as it's ever going to get. (Lost the details on where I downloaded it from.) The others are C/D training pics of the time, with a couple of restorations thrown in. (Always the worst reference - damn phillips head screws!!!!)
I have to agree Chris that the plating under the shield is wrong. Hopefully a new hood will hide this section and give the appearance of raising the pit higher as Sparrow points out.
Scrounging around I got some more reference. You are right on the money PeterD with your cover texture!
Cheers,
- Mysticpuma - 10.06.2008
Taurus and Poncho, in-case it hasn't been asked for before, may I request that the cockpit canopy is modded so that it can slide back, you know like it did in real-life. You may have seen my previous posts in the cockpit mod section about my awe at the work you are doing to the P-47, which at long last is getting the attention it deserves!
The quality of your work is exceptional, but just for a realism effect and if possible, could the canopy be made/allowed or modded to slide for added realism?
Here's hoping cheers, MP (formerly Spidermonkey in previous posts
)
- poncho - 10.06.2008
taurus Wrote:Poncho,
The top panel hood would be pretty difficult to get right using the panel.tga alone. Although the texture goes pretty high. I will look into it. Maybe another mesh to save the day? There are pitot and static lines feeding into the instruments that should be included as well.
,
As far as added texturing on panel.tga I was asking only about the rubber? edging on the rim of the panel. I agree that the hooding could probably not be added by using panel.tga.
I will experiment a bit with raising the pit also. I did raise it slightly already for the gunsight mod.
Poncho
- FA_Diablo - 10.06.2008
Chris great pictures. Taurus...yours too. I like the idea of raising the pit some more too. That if I'm right would improve the overall view outside teh cockpit and make for better deflection shots looking over the cowling. I'm with Mystic too I like the idea of a sliding canopy, but only if it will not cause graphical problems. I hear there are some problems with the sliding canopy of the Tempest or Spit. With the progress you 2 are making on weekends I wish everyday was a weekend.
- SparrowThree - 10.06.2008
To be honest I didn't look at the links, It was from memory. I looked through some references after my last post and the sight arm sits higher than I remember. The placard I mentioned is on the far left of the bottom left image. I was wrong about it's location.
Regardless, I am excited to see the progress being made and can't wait for the finished product.
- chris455 - 10.06.2008
SparrowThree Wrote:Regardless, I am excited to see the progress being made and can't wait for the finished product.
You and I both!
- Guest - 10.06.2008
I am not a fan of Thunderbolt at all, but this is beginning to look very good.
- FA_Diablo - 11.06.2008
chris455 Wrote:SparrowThree Wrote:Regardless, I am excited to see the progress being made and can't wait for the finished product.
You and I both!
Us 3!!!!
- FA_Diablo - 11.06.2008
Avala Wrote:I am not a fan of Thunderbolt at all, but this is beginning to look very good.
Avala....Cave Tonitrum...aka. "Fear the Thunderbolt" LOL It is looking very good especially to us that love the T-Bolt and fly her 99.9% of the time.
- Jaws2002 - 12.06.2008
310thDiablo Wrote:Avala Wrote:I am not a fan of Thunderbolt at all, but this is beginning to look very good.
Avala....Cave Tonitrum...aka. "Fear the Thunderbolt" LOL It is looking very good especially to us that love the T-Bolt and fly her 99.9% of the time.
If you are flying one plane for 99.9% of the time you are missing out on 99.9% of the game. :mrgreen:
Saying that doesn't mean I don't love to fly the P-47. :lol: