[matsher]

Hi guys this is the definative thread on Forcefeed back problems and possible solution.

If you have been pulling your hair out wondering why your FF joystciks are not
playing ball then you've come to the right place. And if you are a bof on this subject
please we need your input. This is a problem for many of us new to FF joysticks
and there are a number of issues that need addressing.

Firstly here is a small program created by MicroSoft years ago to Edit FF profiles. (Called FEdit)
It is an easy to use utility to test and change your games FF profiles.
WARNING: Create a back up of your FF folder before you start getting creative
with your profiles. You can get a little carried away. Enjoy - Lugnut -

Right here's the Dealio... I just got my Saitek EVO FF joystick and like most I took for granted
that all I have to do to enjoy the best game experince is to plug the damn thing in, load the
drivers and shazamm! How wrong was I.
The Stick worked perfectly in the XP game controller set up utils and the FF was amazing.
I loaded up IL2 and it felt like I was flying with a wet noodle. The guns FF was so weak it is hardly worth mentioning and there was no feeling at all in stalls or High G turns etc. I was pissed.
So started a 5 days investigation. I went to every website and trawled every forum to
get to the bottom of this FUBAR. I found many refernces to similar experiences by others in many different forums. There were no actual answers. There were only some lame responses by the usual suspects saying shit like:"Have you turned you FF on in game or (my favourite) is your Joystick plugged in.
What was interesting was many people with the same Saitek joystick were getting different results from the same game. Half the people said that there was hardly or barely any FF from the Saitek in IL2 1946 and the other half were saying that the FF was incredibly good and so strong that they had to turn the FF down to manage to fly properly. Now for a guy like me thats very interesting...

Thats when I went for an all out seach to find this FEdit program that was mentioned. It was a pain to find (20hrs) but I finally found it in a back-water website and now I was in a position to see for myself. I found out that my FF profiles (located in your main game folder) were pittiful and confirmed that my joystick was working perfectly. So confused and dazed I wondered how my profiles could of been changed/corrupted. My only conclusion at the moment is that in the modding process somehow my FF profile files were modded/changed as well.

So, 5 days later I am here writing to you guys, I have found that IL2 is in desperate need for well crafted FF profiles, for which I am not qualified to create. there must be some gifted geniuses out there who understand the alga/logarithyms (Spelling) code for making FF profiles and, of course how IL2 applies them to the Flight modeling in game.

Also for all you guys who have FF joysticks and are not getting the most out of them, you are welcome to create new profiles (they are so easy to create) and the bofs can put them all together so us.
(for instance you can create a specific profile for when your left/right wing cannon gets hit and stops working - you can make your FF stick vibrate just to the right or to the left etc etc.) It is that customizable.

So what are you waiting for download FEdit and get going!!!!!

Now, I have a technical question that I need answered. So please can someone intelligent answer me. I bought the Saitek FF Joystick to get the feeling of true flight dynamics ie when I am flying fast I want the stick to harden/stiffen up and when I am slow (landing for instance) the stick will become mushy. I don't have that feeling in any way with the current profiles I have. I know that IL2 is meant to have that FF effect programmed. Can someone please supply me (and everyone else) with an answer to how it works/why/and where that profile is that controls this effect. And if its too limp/lame how we can cranck it up and give it horns. Thanks.
- Lugnut -









for the Force Feedcak Editor go here > (The link is inoperative)

[slipper]

Matsher thanks for this, just had a little play about and it looks very promising.

In my forcefeedback folder of IL2 i have 7 forcefeedback files, do you know if i can add more, or rename the ones i have, or does the game only recognise these 7 ?

regards

slipper

[matsher]

Slipper. yes there are only 7 profiles. And in all versions of IL2 there are the same 7 profiles.

You ask a very good question. I am sorry but I am just a grunt like you, the only difference is that I am a pissed off grunt and I am determined to get to the bottom of this dilemma.

So I will answer what I can... Yes you can make more profiles, as many and as varied as you like.
I just do not have the Technical skills to know how to incorporate them into the game in such a way that they will work seemlessly with the IL2 code that controls the FF.

Thats why this thread was created... I want it to become the definative FF thread. I have written to Immersion studios. The guys who create the FF test profiles for all the Joystick manufacturers (Saitek, Logitek, MicroSoft, genius etc) waiting for a response, will get one after the American 4th July weekend)
I have also been in contact with Saitek themselves but they (the UK branch) are not that clued up.
I will get in touch with the USA branch on monday. Maybe they aren't staffed by retartds.

I am still calling for all knowledgable technical bofs who are sussed on program code and who can guide/help us on this IL2 FF quest... Hopefully we can be enjoying our FF joysticks full potential by next week.
- Lugnut

[Bearcat]

Is there a way to prevent the loss of the stick forces if you ALT+TAB out of the sim and re-open it? I loose my FFB when I do that.. that's why I only use the stick forces because they still functin even if FFB is turned off in the sim.

[Blacknight]

I would love someone to mod forces like they have in FSX that would make it even better. However I am just like you guys praying for one of these coders to get into action and creating more force elements to add on to the 7 in the folder.

Knight

[matsher]

I have got some intersting results from my FF test on FEdit.

All the guys with Saitek sticks... I have managed to get the stick harden up quite well
while in flight... So no more wet noodle feel. I have also tweaked some of the existing
Forces to give a more realistic feeling through the joystick so there is a better measure of control.

I dont have another FF stick to test with yet so if some guys with another brand of FF stick
can contribute some "feedback" to this disscusion, that would be great. I tried to get hold of
Ubisoft and ran into a brick wall of burocracy. Fucking Dicks! So we are on our own.

We still need a coding expert to help on the back end stuff.

So if you guys want to try out my new FF profiles. Drop me a line and your address and
I will mail them to you. If anyone want to speak to me directly about this interesting subject
I am normally on TeamSpeak comm in the evening. I am on GMT+2 so you do the math.
The AAA guys generally know where to get hold of me. Lugnut

[Guest]

MS Force Feedback 2 joysticks

For those of us using one of these, I've come across some useful information about this stick. (All of which dates from before my time..)

The original heyday of this stick was around 2000-2001 and it was seemingly designed to work with Windows98. It came with and required the use of an install disc with drivers to set it up and get it to work. (If you don't have this disc it's available at M4T download section, under joystick utilities, called "2 Microsoft Sidewinder gamer control software v4.0").

This software originally (under win98) allowed the setting up of a dead zone, macro keystrokes, and FF strength settings. Under plug and play, which arrived with the introduction of XP some of these options are no longer available and I haven't yet tried to see if the macros are still programmable.

Under XP's stock drivers all stick forces are set to max. These crucially include return to centre forces, which according to the user guide for the original software, should only be enabled for games that do not support this.

In IL2 it appears we have twice the required RTC forces which probably accounts for the wobbles when you shoot and the hopeful pleas by all of us for a better profile.

Having installed this software and turned off the RTC forces, the stick gets much easier and smoother to use. It also permits stick feedback forces to be lowered. Set to minimum , this gives a really nice subtle feel when flying and shooting, particularly when used together with a FF effects profile called "2 Mantis feedback", found with the above at M4T. See what you think, I think it's a big improvement on the xp drivers for this stick.

[skif_vk]

hey guys,

i've downloaded some modded ff files
few years ago from anywhere.
if anyone interested i could send.

i'm not very lucky with them.
but it's still better then original with my Evo FF,
but worse then my old "Logitech Wingman FF".

(i think i will buy a cougar this year, i need more precision in flight&shooting)

[Guest]

Skif,

Yes please upload them somewhere, I will try them. Have gone back to original ff although with RTC forces still switched off. Couldn't get used to not having to heave the stick about lol!

Regards J

[skif_vk]

hey to all AAA'ers,

i've uploaded them



http://files.filefront.com/il2+ForceFee ... einfo.html

[wintergoose]

I have tried them, but they seens to have a verry week reaction on the Evo Force stick.
I nearly feel the feedback.
And the problem are the same the stick is forced toward me and make it difficult to steer the plane .
I have also turned of the fedback in the conf.ini fil, but still same problem the stick is forsed toward me and out of senter for the stic.
I am verry disapointed with the Evo Pro Force feedback stic. Have used the X45 with now problem (it is worn outh now) and was seeng forward to have the forcefeedback with the Evo Pro now.
I deeply hope sombody know a solution to this problem, I see others on the forum also mentions this stic outh of senter problems.

[LW_Stein]

So basically nobody has a friend who's into coding these kind of settings?

I know this thread is old, but i was hoping someone would have come up with the answer by now.


thanks for starting this topic Matsher, hope you've struck gold somewhere!


Regards,


Steiny

EDit.. forgot to add: the filefront file is no longer there.. that's why i replied to this posting.