[Dixiecapt]

No i don't have the answer, I was hoping some of you could help build a thread of pilot tips for such.

Everytime I go up against some Mig-15's I find most of my AI and Myself get outflown.

Two understandable points, Most of the Mig Pilots were Green, and Most of the Saber Pilots were Veterans from War Two, historically. Is that why history pits the Mig-15 and Saber as equals?

The other point is I'm not the greatest pilot. I spend most of my time in a book, and FMB+. :}

However, I'd love to hear from you E-pilots on how you tackle a Mig-15(bis) with your F-86s in IL-2?

Thanks!

[Alemart_el_Redentor]

Well as for i know the early F-86 were not a total match for the MiG-15, so if the FD's are properly set, we should be having a hard time fighting them :p

[Dixiecapt]

By the way, Many thanks to PeteD for these planes!!!

[Dixiecapt]

Well as for i know the early F-86 were not a total match for the MiG-15, so if the FD's are properly set, we should be having a hard time fighting them :p

Good, then they are historicly set, now how do you fight them?

[European Snake]

Well as for i know the early F-86 were not a total match for the MiG-15, so if the FD's are properly set, we should be having a hard time fighting them :p

Good, then they are historicly set, now how do you fight them?

From above, at least in IL2. In the real world the Mig always had a higher rate of climb. If we were lucky we found them from above, but usually you were the guy praying the Migs above don't see you.

[amharic]

Well you have to take into account a couple points before you get started.
Real-Life
1) Sabre A5 in normal instances could go as fast as 570 mph (920 km/h), not including supersonic which was possible in dives, otherwise only transonic.
2)Mig-15, not bis version, only 25-75mph slower level flight (I think), however it is compensated by its superior climbing ability.
3) Sabre pilots = WW2, Majority Mig pilots = less experienced korean pilots, and russian pilots "ponchos" =WW2
4) Sabre nice comfortabley large cockpit, k14 gyro sight, Mig 15, very tight and enclosed, = uncomfortable.
5)Sabre had 6 50 cals= more ammo, better in some cases, but less powerful, allows for less experinced fliers more shots at a target. Mig 15 2 23 mm cannons, and 1 37mm. Hard to shoot at targets for inexperienced, deadly with an ace.


IL2 1946
1) Mig bis outclasses f86 A5, really a f86E and Mig15bis are a more equal choice
2) How comfortable your chair is, vibrators...
3)The whole skill factor of the wars is dropped out of the equation. It's how long you spend your hours at a computer screen :roll:

Now for the real tips. If you are flying with a squadron online persay, always have a wingman. Always turn into the attack and put your Sabre into a dive since it does have a faster dive. Always keep altitude since Mig can outclimb you. Do not go low and slow since Mig15 accelerates faster and cannons can knock you out with one burst. Keep your throttle up, me and my squad do manevurs like the Thatch Weave since the mig usally misses on first shot. Only works if your going at a relatively slower speed, if bracketed good, always dive away. Thats all I can say since I am not a real pilot and the the real aircraft characteristics do not fully apply in game. Otherwise its generally trial and error. Good Luck!

[StarGazer]

As I understand the two combatants - other than pilot experience - the main differences were:

The Mig15 had a greater climb rate and a higher ceiling than the F86.

The Mig had heavier armament.

It could not dive as fast as the Sabre - the controls would become heavy and the aircraft would buffet and the pilot could not pull out.

Advantage would be to engage from high using BnZ and if the flight characteristics on the Mig in IL2 are accurate getting him into a dive while offensive should prove effective. Going defensive would be to initiate a dive to evade.

I think (and please correct me on this) the Sabre had a bit of an advantage in speed in level flight and was a more stable gun platform including a superior avionics package.

Have fun.

[ordway]

I also understand that at low altitudes, the Sabre could also out turn the Mig-15s. So drag the Mig down to around 10,000-15,000 feet and out turn him.

[George Formby]

S~
best way I have seen is 4 to 1 odds :lol:

[JG14_Jagr]

This is a subject you could write a book about, not just a post. I love the KTO fights.. even better than the ETO. I've read loads of technical data and also lots of pilot accounts which you can garner a lot of information from but you need to take them with a grain of salt because of their subjective nature in most cases.

The F86A5 in IL2 is the earliest version to see action in numbers. The Mig15bis is an improved version of the original Mig15 design. This particular plane set gives you the widest possible performance gaps between the types. The F86E was being introduced when the 15bis was arriving in theater. The key differences in performance are the ceiling and the rate of climb..in that order. The Mig and Sabre had similar engines but the Mig was signifigantly lighter which had obvious advantages in performance. The ceiling and high alt performance of the Mig therefore was superior for this reason. The Migs had the ability to cruise at 10,000 feet above the early Sabres and dictate when to fight at will. Thereforre they could enter at a time and position of their choosing, use a major E advantage to slash through and use that E along with a 30% better climb rate to stay outside of the Sabres envelope of engagement.

As the Sabre was re engined, from the E model through the F model those 2 advantages evened out signifignantly with the F-30 and F-40 versions having a much closer climb rate to the Mig15bis and about the same operational ceiling. This stripped away the massive advantage the early Migs had over the early Sabres in the KTO. As with all AC each had a "sweet spot" altitude where it held a performance edge. Because of the Thrust to Weight advantage of the Mig, generally the higher the better in terms of fighting Sabres, especially ealry versions. At around 30K feet the denser air started to let the Sabres aerodynamic advantages overcome the Migs pure power advantage.

Overall speeds were relatively close..close enough that unless you were in an extended tail chase they were not going to be a deciding factor in a fight. High speed handling performance (especially as the Alt lowered) went to the Sabre..turn rates varied with altitude with each having a slight advantage or being more or less even depending on the height tested. In initial powered dives the Mig had the edge (big engine pushing a lighter body) but the Sabre would catch and then surpass the Mig by a signifigant margin if the dive was extended when weight began to help rather than hurt.

Sabre had a signifigantly better sighting system.. a generation ahead of the Migs. The Migs site system was far less effective in practice.

Weapons. an argument unto itself. The Migs "pod" design made maintenance and service dramatically easier. The 37mm combined with the 2 23mm put out a very high "weight" of fire. The shells travelled along a different ballistic paths despite having similar muzzle velocities. They fired at a relatively slow rate of fire and a relative slow muzlzle velocity. It made accurate targeting of a small maneuvering aircraft very difficult at longer ranges. That being said, the tradeoff is that if you were able to get rounds on target they were very lethal to small aircraft.

The Sabres .50 calibers were the other end of the spectrum, 6 concentrated .50 caliber MG firing at a very high rate of fire and a high muzzle velocity combined with a radar ranging gun sight gave a high hit probability even at signifigant ranges specially for non maneuvering targets. The tradeoff in this case was weight of fire. Against highly mobile target a snap shot was often not sufficent to get lethal damage on target in the brief engagement window. The API ammunition was not as effective at extreme altitudes where oxygen was scarce. Then again, Mig15's had minimal armor and reports I've read of wounded Soviet pilots would indicate that Mig 15 pilots were often incapacitated or killed outright in Migs that were shot down.

Based on my information, when the F86F-30 model is released, there will be relative parity in AC performance with each having slight advantages in various situations, but nothing so glaring that good (or bad) pilot skill cannot compansate for it.

As far as tactics against the Migs in game with the A5, enter with an E advantage if at all possible and when you have an opportunity to put rounds on the Mig15 do not hesitate. If allowed to climb away they will, so fire early and often and if you damage them it will reduce their performance signifigantly. If you don't expect a lot of high side attacks from above after they climb out of reach.

[US_GRANT]

Well I've flown against the MiG extensively in the KTO in game and once they start manovering, the best thing I've found is to get down low and turn until they exhaust their ammo or gas and turn for home then run them down like dogs. Any AI setting from Average on up means you will have an extremely hard time fighting them. Unfortunately, Rookie setings means they lumber along like old bombers and make big fat juicy targets. No fun at all.

[Guest]

you will then have a fighting chance but will still get outflown.....

what a sim....fantastic what we have here and getting better every day....

pd

[Lefty Hartnett]

I solved the problem by switching to the Mig----lol

[Cranky.1]

No i don't have the answer, I was hoping some of you could help build a thread of pilot tips for such.

Everytime I go up against some Mig-15's I find most of my AI and Myself get outflown.

Two understandable points, Most of the Mig Pilots were Green, and Most of the Saber Pilots were Veterans from War Two, historically. Is that why history pits the Mig-15 and Saber as equals?

The other point is I'm not the greatest pilot. I spend most of my time in a book, and FMB+. :}

However, I'd love to hear from you E-pilots on how you tackle a Mig-15(bis) with your F-86s in IL-2?

Thanks!

:roll: More then 20% of North Korean Mig-15 Pilots where WWII U.S.S.R. Veterans. And the Mig-15 just out class the F-86.
The U.S.A.F. where better at Dog fighting you might have to go to Chuck Yaegers Top Gun School.

[Cranky.1]

No i don't have the answer, I was hoping some of you could help build a thread of pilot tips for such.

Everytime I go up against some Mig-15's I find most of my AI and Myself get outflown.

Two understandable points, Most of the Mig Pilots were Green, and Most of the Saber Pilots were Veterans from War Two, historically. Is that why history pits the Mig-15 and Saber as equals?

The other point is I'm not the greatest pilot. I spend most of my time in a book, and FMB+. :}

However, I'd love to hear from you E-pilots on how you tackle a Mig-15(bis) with your F-86s in IL-2?

Thanks!

:roll: More then 20% of North Korean Mig-15 Pilots where WWII U.S.S.R. Veterans. And the Mig-15 just out class the F-86.
The U.S.A.F. where better at Dog fighting you might have to go to Chuck Yaegers Top Gun School.