[pursuivant]

Once upon a time, a talented skinner did a bunch of nice "what if CSA" skins. He also did some "Union" skins based on 1860s Federal flags. Danged if I can remember his name or his web site. It might have been Ghost Rider, but Google isn't being helpful.

IIRC, on those skins, the upper and lower wings and fuselage had the square battle flag while the tail flash was the first national flag (the original "stars and bars" with 7 white stars in a circle on a navy blue canton). No disrespect to Caldrail, but I liked that design better - it's more obvious as to what nation you're shooting at.

If some modder really wants to add the CSA to the list of Forgotten Countries, I really couldn't care one way or the other, but they really don't make sense given the dearth of maps for the U.S. (i.e., Grand Canyon, proposed Texas map which hasn't yet seen the light of day). We've already got the TinTin fictional countries (Borduria and Syldavia) and some fictional Pacific and European maps to go with them.

If you want to add historical nations though, how markings for nations which actually had air forces - like the Austro-Hungarian Empire, Imperial Germany and the Ottoman Empire?

[Radoye]

If you want to add historical nations though, how markings for nations which actually had air forces - like the Austro-Hungarian Empire, Imperial Germany and the Ottoman Empire?

A-H and Germany would have exactly same markings - first the Iron Cross later switch to Balkenkreutz. WWI Bulgaria too.

Ottoman Turkey had the same markings as the later Turkey. Early on the markings used to be either black or red squares, later they settled on red.

[BH_Blue]

Confederate States of America ?

LOL :lol: Sorry mate, I just have to laugh a little at the thought of seeing a Hillbilly faced pilot behind a P-51 Pony, or
worse, some scary guys in KKK suits and masks! Gosh!
I wonder who would be their President ?
Joseph McCarthy or J.Edgar Hoover ?
I think a few years back someone did some skins for a similar idea as yours. I remember seeing some screenshots
back in the old UBI_IL-2 forum. They might still be around in someplace.

I find your narrow minded views of the south,
one- disturbing
two- annoying
three- wrong

If you want to add historical nations though, how markings for nations which actually had air forces - like the Austro-Hungarian Empire, Imperial Germany and the Ottoman Empire?

Because those countries have no interest to me. I dont support slavery, racism or any of that jazz. I do however find the history of the southern confederacy interesting.

[George Formby]

Confederate States of America ?

LOL :lol: Sorry mate, I just have to laugh a little at the thought of seeing a Hillbilly faced pilot behind a P-51 Pony, or
worse, some scary guys in KKK suits and masks! Gosh!
I wonder who would be their President ?
Joseph McCarthy or J.Edgar Hoover ?
I think a few years back someone did some skins for a similar idea as yours. I remember seeing some screenshots
back in the old UBI_IL-2 forum. They might still be around in someplace.

[/quote]
S`~ LOL, Ya know there were a few aces from WW2 from the good ole south. I for one am sitting right smack in the middle of the south, and was in the US Army for 18 yrs. The military has a way of taking the "hillbilly" look away from ya. I remember my old drill hated boys from the south, and use to say to me on a regular basis "Bet thats yer first pair of boots, huh Campbell" I would remark "Naw Drill Sergeant, this has to be at least my third..." for that I pushed Fort Benning at least 2 inches lower with push up.... Like I said earlier, rent or buy CSI: confederate states of america, it will give you a lot to laugh, and to think about.
V/R
George

[pursuivant]

If you want to add historical nations though, how markings for nations which actually had air forces - like the Austro-Hungarian Empire, Imperial Germany and the Ottoman Empire?

A-H and Germany would have exactly same markings - first the Iron Cross later switch to Balkenkreutz. WWI Bulgaria too.

Ottoman Turkey had the same markings as the later Turkey. Early on the markings used to be either black or red squares, later they settled on red.

Specifically, I was thinking of early WWI A-H with the early red-white-red markings on the wingtips, and perhaps an A-H medals pack. I know they later switch to German markings.

For Imperial Germany, I was thinking red and blue sides (so you can have fights vs. the Russians with Russians red and Germans blue, and fights on the Western Front with Germany red and the U.S./France/UK blue) with the Balkankreuz and the WWI Eisenkreuz, which had arms which were longer and narrower than the WW2 versions (and, of course, no swastika tail flashes). Add to that the WWI medals, with the Ritterkreuz at the top of the heap. Since I'm dreaming, you might as well add the post-WW2 Luftwaffe to the list - fighting for Blue, but with the modern, smaller, Balkankreuz and a de-Nazified medals pack.

Ottoman Empire markings varied. I was thinking of the early black squares edged in white. The current markings for Turkey are WW2 era - red edged in white.

I'm sure that the Canvas Knights wizards will fix the problem eventually, but no harm in someone else having a try at it.

[pursuivant]

Confederate States of America ?
Ya know there were a few aces from WW2 from the good ole south. I for one am sitting right smack in the middle of the south, and was in the US Army for 18 yrs. The military has a way of taking the "hillbilly" look away from ya. I remember my old drill hated boys from the south, and use to say to me on a regular basis "Bet thats yer first pair of boots, huh Campbell" I would remark "Naw Drill Sergeant, this has to be at least my third..." for that I pushed Fort Benning at least 2 inches lower with push up.... Like I said earlier, rent or buy CSI: confederate states of america, it will give you a lot to laugh, and to think about.

Your drill sergeant must have been very popular, given as Ft. Benning is in Georgia.

I just cringe when I see anyone proposing anything to do with the Confederacy on the internet, unless it's on a heavily moderated forum dealing specifically with the conflict - there's way too many nuts who want to keep refighting the damned thing until the South wins and it draws flames like a gasoline-soaked Buddhist monk with a political grievance. If you thought that "chart wars" over the precise performance of the Bf-109 were bad, you haven't lived through some of the Usenet flame wars about the "War Between the States."

Hell, on this forum we couldn't go 1 screen of posts before I saw the usual anti-southern slurs and the beginnings of the typical "slavery = ultimate evil" vs. "states rights = glorious lost cause" flame war.

IMO, any citizen of the United States who wants to refight the damned thing, online or in the field, is an idiot. The American Civil War was a national tragedy for both sides. Single greatest loss of American lives in a single day - check (see Antietam). Single greatest loss of life - by percentage of population - for any war in the nation's history - check. Most expensive war in the country's history in terms of percentage of GDP (counting in the horrendous damage to the Southern states) - check. Vicious multi-day battles that wasted thousands of lives to no good purpose and whittled units down to virtually no survivors - right up there with WWI, Vietnam and some of the less glorious U.S. WW2 campaigns in the Heurtgen Forest and Italy.

As for studying the conflict in detail - my advice is to put down your Bruce Catton or Steven Ambrose or "Battles and Leaders" and back away slowly. Every literate survivor of the damned conflict published a memoir, then spent the rest of their lives squabbling over who did what, when and why, in print. Add to that the relative lack of battlefield censorship and the facts that that the ACW was the big turning point in U.S. history and that the part of the country that lost is filled with proud people who hate to lose, you could float every ship ever built on the oceans of ink spilled discussing "The Cause." Without exaggeration, a young man could spend his entire lifetime JUST studying the official U.S. records of the conflict. Really, your time is much better spent shooting down virtual airplanes, or rolling the world's largest ball of rubber bands, or teaching your cat to break dance.

[fly_zo]

ok gents ... this is getting out of control

please stay on topic from now on ..... without political/moral or any other "off" discussion


thank you
Z

[George Formby]

:?:

[Bobbo]

Edited by Moggy:

Please don't ignore an admin or moderator's request; stay on topic

[P/O W. 'Moggy' Cattermole]

Bobbo, I'll thank you NOT to ignore Fly_zo's previous request.

I really hope you were being ironic.

Gents, Stay on topic!

[Murph]

Just for the record, I have no personal objection to someone creating a "forgotten counties" mod to include a hypothetical CSA. If someone wants to do the work needed, go for it.

[George Formby]

"just cringe when I see anyone proposing anything to do with the Confederacy on the internet, unless it's on a heavily moderated forum dealing specifically with the conflict - there's way too many nuts who want to keep refighting the damned thing until the South wins and it draws flames like a gasoline-soaked Buddhist monk with a political grievance. If you thought that "chart wars" over the precise performance of the Bf-109 were bad, you haven't lived through some of the Usenet flame wars about the "War Between the States."

Hell, on this forum we couldn't go 1 screen of posts before I saw the usual anti-southern slurs and the beginnings of the typical "slavery = ultimate evil" vs. "states rights = glorious lost cause" flame war.

IMO, any citizen of the United States who wants to refight the damned thing, online or in the field, is an idiot. The American Civil War was a national tragedy for both sides. Single greatest loss of American lives in a single day - check (see Antietam). Single greatest loss of life - by percentage of population - for any war in the nation's history - check. Most expensive war in the country's history in terms of percentage of GDP (counting in the horrendous damage to the Southern states) - check. Vicious multi-day battles that wasted thousands of lives to no good purpose and whittled units down to virtually no survivors - right up there with WWI, Vietnam and some of the less glorious U.S. WW2 campaigns in the Heurtgen Forest and Italy.

As for studying the conflict in detail - my advice is to put down your Bruce Catton or Steven Ambrose or "Battles and Leaders" and back away slowly. Every literate survivor of the damned conflict published a memoir, then spent the rest of their lives squabbling over who did what, when and why, in print. Add to that the relative lack of battlefield censorship and the facts that that the ACW was the big turning point in U.S. history and that the part of the country that lost is filled with proud people who hate to lose, you could float every ship ever built on the oceans of ink spilled discussing "The Cause." Without exaggeration, a young man could spend his entire lifetime JUST studying the official U.S. records of the conflict. Really, your time is much better spent shooting down virtual airplanes, or rolling the world's largest ball of rubber bands, or teaching your cat to break dance."

How is this ON TOPIC as opposed to what I wrote Zo??? If your going to edit, do it on ALL sides, thats the fairness of it all

Thank you
G

[pursuivant]

George F. -

Sorry about accidentally deleting the quote tag. Part of my post got deleted. I didn't mean to "speak" for you.

In my original message, I mentioned that a modder, whose name I can't remember, who did some very nice hypothetical CSA skins. I've found some of them on my HD, but no joy on finding the original site. As I said, the upper and lower wing flashes have the CSA battle flag. Tail flash isn't the 1st national flag, as I thought, just a "red-white-red" tail flash derived from the 1st national flag - reminiscent of the early WW1 Austro-Hungarian wingtip markings. I'll keep looking for the web site. If I can't find anything, I'll just share what I've got on my HD.


Anyhow, I've got no problem with skins for historic or hypothetical nations, or even historical or hypothetical countries. I'm just mortally sick of another flame war about the War Between the States. I should have kept my thoughts to myself - another reminder to not type when half asleep.

Again, George, apologies

[fly_zo]

ok...

locked

reg
Z