[Karaya]

Your personal truth, Kwiatos?

How about this document, this is not calculated data but TESTED (except for the 190A-3)



Comparison test from december 1941

Bf 109 F-4 670 km/h in 6.2 km alt / 625 km/h in 10 km alt (flown)
Bf 109 G-1 700 km/h in 7.0 km alt /660 km/h in 10 km alt (flown)
Fw 190 A-2 650 km/h in 5.8 km alt (flown)
Fw 190 A-3 700 km/h in 5.9 km alt (estimated only)

And no, GM-1 was neither used on the F-4 nor on the G-1 in the test. In fact it says that when using GM-1 there is a further speed increased of 120km/h.

700km/h for the G-1! With 1.42ata rating but still!

660-670 for a G-1/-2 at 1.3ata at 7km altitude therefore is perfectly possible. Subtract the odd 12km/h of a tailwheel and a handful for the wingbuldges and we are at ~650km/h for a G-6.



We already had that one but I just want to remake that point. That Soviet test that gave 666km/h was flown at 1.3ata and in clean configuration. With gondolas it was STILL 650km/h and those twin 20mm MG151/20 sure make a lot more drag than a simple tailwheel and a small bump in the wing.

Why it's at 1.3ata? Pure and simple logic! The Bf109F-4 thats stated with 1350PS (thats 1.42ata for the DB601E) is only coming in at 624km/h... thats clearly not 1.42ata performance (a lower end figure for even the 1.3ata rating), so the G-2 is certainly also only flying at 1.3ata although it is stated to be powered by 1475 horses



In case you're still arguing, another test! This shows speed deviations among production models of the Bf109G with DB 605 A, 30 min climb + combat power = 1.3 ata/2600rpm 1350 PS, 3080 kg, cooler flaps open: 660 km/h TAS in FTH

Cooler flaps are OPEN and the average maximum speed is STILL 660km/h! So much for that...



Bf109G-1/R2 (so with GM-1 equipment which however is NOT used here and only useful ABOVE FTH) - 700km/h @ 6600m

The results are to be understood as without the use of GM-1 dinitrous-oxide boost for high altitudes. Use of GM-1 gave a very prounounced boost above 8km altitude, increasing engine output by 300 (!!) PS. Preparations for use of GM-1 were present on all G-1 and G-3 pressurized fighters; several hundred of the other 109G subtypes were converted for it's use from the factory line. To give some idea of the potential, R. Klein had achieved 680 km/h at 12 000 m and a ceiling of 13 800 m in a Bf 109G-1/R2 with GM-1 injection.

And you actually also have to take into consideration that the installation of the GM-1 boost increased weight by about 170kg! Still the aircraft attained 700km/h without making use of it.

And you are suggesting that a G-6 that is actually lighter than a GM-1 equipped G-1 should be drastically slower?

Maybe YOU should face the truth for once!

You really should read more carrefully avialable charts and data

You too, from your own data:

http://kurfurst.org/Performance_tests/1 ... blatt.html

Soviet trials on Bf 109G-4 WNr. 19 968 tested by the NII VVS in October 1943. The aircraft had non-retractable tailwheel and achieved 508 km/h achieved at Sea level and 650 km/h at 7 km. Another Bf 109G tested by the NII VVS, Bf 109 G-2, WNr. 14 513, but with retractable tailwheel, achieved 524 km/h achieved at Sea level and 666 km/h at 7 km. Soviet results agree well with the Rechlin figures, except for Sea level, however it is a general trend on all Soviet Bf 109 trials to show sharply recurving speed curves near ground level for some unknown reason. Bf 109 G-2 WNr. 14 783, tested in Finnland in April 1943, achieved 522 km/h at SL, and 636 km/h at 6300m altitude. Speeds achieved at altitude show a marked drop-off on this plane. Aircraft had non-retractable tailwheel. All abovementioned performance trials were performed using Steig- und Kampfleistung 30-min power (ie. 1.3ata, 2600 revs/min).

So this Bf109G-4 reached 650km/h at 7km at 1.3ata. Lets again remind ourselves that between the G-4 and G-6 lies a weight difference of ridiculous 10-15kg. Both have a fixed tailwheel and most probably also the kidney shaped wing buldges.

Now your point before was what?

You're actually contradicting yourself on a constant basis, its funny really. And then you're spouting off from your high throne that I should read data more carefully? Give me a break!

This discussion has started off to be very interesting but you soon developed a very arrogant tone that I'm neither willing to take nor to accept any further.

And before bashing any of the aircraft modders in these forums: I have yet to see any of your creations to see the light of day here on AAA. If you think you are so much more knowledgable than us poor fm idiots over here then surely you can come up with better stuff?

Bf109G-14A/S reach 725 km at 6 km

Already corrected in the upcoming UI button and the AC_Installer