[RRuger]

the reason many bombers survived wasn't just the uselessness of the .303 round; it was RAF doctrine. Guns were set to converge at 400 yards (about 360 meters) but a lot of attacks happened far closer; as the guns were not harmonised, the guns sprayed the whole aircraft, riddling it with bullet holes and not actually doing anything more than superficial damage. However, it is true that a mix of cannons and Mgs were more effective.

That's debatable my friend, a bullet hole is a bullet hole, whether spray & pray or dead center of the convergence.

true,but a l ot of bullets that strike an entire aircraft will likely not do as much as a stream of bullets converging on a single point. Ture, .303 is clearly inferior to 20mm cannon, but even so, a single .303 striking an engine may not do much, but 20 or 30 might.

I wasn't speaking to what it takes to knock out an engine I was refering to this statememt that you made to Karaya;
"the reason many bombers survived wasn't just the uselessness of the .303 round; it was RAF doctrine. Guns were set to converge at 400 yards (about 360 meters) but a lot of attacks happened far closer; as the guns were not harmonised, the guns sprayed the whole aircraft, riddling it with bullet holes and not actually doing anything more than superficial damage. However, it is true that a mix of cannons and Mgs were more effective."
To his statement; "
.303s or any kind of rifle calibre machine gun for that matter will prove to be rather ineffective against most bombers both in the sim and in real life. There's a reason they put so many of them onto a fighter aircraft. During the BoB many a Luftwaffe bomber came back home with literally hundreds of bullet holes all over but no critical damages sustained, thats why even with 8x.303s they later upgraded the Spitfire to 2x20mm on top of 2 pairs of MGs and the Hurricane finally to 4x20mm."

Which is documented. I have no issue with your point about the center of convergence being more powerful than spraying the bombers from a distance farther than what the gun convergence is set to, what I'm saying is that the Nazi bombers DID come home like Swiss cheese, which is documented. I am a hunter, got several shotguns and I shoot trap, I can do damage with one BB, I can even knock down the clay, but with a "choked" shot I can shatter it, yes I know. And if what you say it true to your point in that many attacks took place inside the convergence wouldn't then each round have a greater muzzle velocity therefore inflicting more damage per round