30.01.2009, 07:30
Hi at all!!!
About the clipped wings , when was introduced?
Cheers
walter
About the clipped wings , when was introduced?
Cheers
walter
SEMPER INCOMMODUS
Spitfire F Mk IX (1942 - Channel)
30.01.2009, 17:58
walter_solito Wrote:Hi at all!!!
About the clipped wings , when was introduced?
Cheers
walter
The only reference I've found to it is that the prototype for the clipped wings was aircraft W3248 - a MkV which tested the tips. Looks like she went to Boscombe down in early 42 after service with 611 Sqn. Bout April of that year she tested the clipped wingtips, but the first report of squadron usage i can find appears to be in November 1942. There are also comparative flight trials LFVb vs Vb from Boscombe down in November 1942, but that is an aircraft with a different engine as well, so may not relate purely to the clipped wingtips. Those aircraft were the "clipped, cropped and clapped" Spitfires - the Merlin 45M used was a 45 with shortened impeller blades for low altitude work.
Best guess would be mid to late '41, difficult to find a more precise answer than that though sorry
31.01.2009, 04:27
Thanx a lot!!!!
So the use of CW in air combat (and in Q/FMB) can't happened before November 42 in MkV and not before the 1943 for MkIX I hypotize?
Regards
walter
So the use of CW in air combat (and in Q/FMB) can't happened before November 42 in MkV and not before the 1943 for MkIX I hypotize?
Regards
walter
SEMPER INCOMMODUS
03.02.2009, 21:38
Sorry for the lack of updates everyone. Truth is I haven't touched this project for a few weeks due to real life commitments. The 3d mesh bits are all done bar a couple of mapping issues which I need to sort out. I need to run the new model past SparrowThree as he is doing the default skins then I will look to get everything tidied up so I can hand it over to the AAA team.
04.02.2009, 04:16
GBrutus Wrote:Sorry for the lack of updates everyone. Truth is I haven't touched this project for a few weeks due to real life commitments. The 3d mesh bits are all done bar a couple of mapping issues which I need to sort out. I need to run the new model past SparrowThree as he is doing the default skins then I will look to get everything tidied up so I can hand it over to the AAA team.
Thanks mate
No worries though, we'll get it when we get it. Till then, we'll just have to be patient.
Personally, I'm just happy it's being done.
04.02.2009, 11:47
http://images.google.pl/imgres?imgurl=h ... l%26sa%3DN
http://images.google.pl/imgres?imgurl=h ... l%26sa%3DN
Maby somebody will make this skin :?:
http://images.google.pl/imgres?imgurl=h ... l%26sa%3DN
Maby somebody will make this skin :?:
04.02.2009, 18:35
Its a shame not to include the cowl bumps of the first converted Mk5s.
The best pictures I have seen are of BR 138 AU G " Sky Chief II" of 421 squadron in Sppitfires the Canadians Page 45
They are also shown in one of the links here but no one mentions them in the thread.
It would be a shame to make a new 3d model and not include such a distinctive feature of the first mk 5 conversions.
Pongo
ps, they are actually in the very first picture posted in this thread!
The best pictures I have seen are of BR 138 AU G " Sky Chief II" of 421 squadron in Sppitfires the Canadians Page 45
They are also shown in one of the links here but no one mentions them in the thread.
It would be a shame to make a new 3d model and not include such a distinctive feature of the first mk 5 conversions.
Pongo
ps, they are actually in the very first picture posted in this thread!
04.02.2009, 18:43
http://www.spitfiresite.com/reference/va...nts-01.htm
That is the earlier link that explains the 109 g6 like bulges on the converted Mk5s.
On the SkyChief II pictures you can actually see the 9 inch extension to the nose..it is a different tone then the rest of the airframe.
The pictures in the book are provided by one of the pilots, Richard Beal, so they might be pretty rare to see...
That is the earlier link that explains the 109 g6 like bulges on the converted Mk5s.
On the SkyChief II pictures you can actually see the 9 inch extension to the nose..it is a different tone then the rest of the airframe.
The pictures in the book are provided by one of the pilots, Richard Beal, so they might be pretty rare to see...
04.02.2009, 19:52
It's an interesting modification, but were they actually ever used on production aircraft?
The only images I've seen of them appear to be on pre-production aircraft.
I can't remember seeing them on any of the 64 or 611 sqn a/c converted from MkVs, so they may be a very small minority? Even the shot in your link of the 611 aircraft where it says with close scrutiny the bulges can be seen on the far aircraft... - I cant make them out at all there?
I'd just wonder whether we want this aircraft to be a generic representation of the early IX, or a very specific example?
Just a thought.
The only images I've seen of them appear to be on pre-production aircraft.
I can't remember seeing them on any of the 64 or 611 sqn a/c converted from MkVs, so they may be a very small minority? Even the shot in your link of the 611 aircraft where it says with close scrutiny the bulges can be seen on the far aircraft... - I cant make them out at all there?
I'd just wonder whether we want this aircraft to be a generic representation of the early IX, or a very specific example?
Just a thought.
04.02.2009, 20:34
I don't think they should be there. I have only found one or 2 photos out of the bunch that have them.
05.02.2009, 16:59
If we are talking about the (100)Mk5s converted to Mk IXs, then they were comon or universal,
If we are talking about the first production Mk IXs then they were non existant.
They are common in pictures of the conversion batch, but they are fairly low profile and people do not notice them.
No one noticed them in the first picture here.
If we are talking about the first production Mk IXs then they were non existant.
They are common in pictures of the conversion batch, but they are fairly low profile and people do not notice them.
No one noticed them in the first picture here.
05.02.2009, 18:16
Pongo Wrote:If we are talking about the (100)Mk5s converted to Mk IXs, then they were comon or universal,
If we are talking about the first production Mk IXs then they were non existant.
They are common in pictures of the conversion batch, but they are fairly low profile and people do not notice them.
No one noticed them in the first picture here.
Except they're not common, even in the conversions.
The link you posted has converted Vcs in it, but certainly the lead a/c doesn't have them, and possibly the second one doesn't either.
Most of the shots I've seen of 64 or 611 sqn a/c dont have them, and thats looking for them specifically.
Check out the shots on page 5 or 6 of this thread. They're conversions, and don't have the bulges at all.
05.02.2009, 20:10
What would you say those serials are?
Spitfire the History identifies one of them (the one heading into the hanger) as a "standard F IX
Spitfire the History identifies one of them (the one heading into the hanger) as a "standard F IX
05.02.2009, 22:21
Yes, thats right, but also wrong.
It is a standard F.IX as it fits the designation. Merlin 63 engine, 'c' wings.
However, it is also a conversion from the Vc. This is readily identifiable from the cannon bulges, the elevators, the identification light, all of which has been discussed previously in this thread, so doesnt need a recap here.
There is no nomenclature differentiation between Vc conversions and new build IXs so it is a standard F.IX, but without the refinements applied to the later new build F.IXs.
The only serial i can determine from the aircraft on page 5 is the 611 Sqn a/c coded FY-V, and I think the serial is probably BS451, and which is stated in Spitfire The History as a V Conversion.
The nose shots on page 6 are also Vc conversions, easy way to tell on those is the teardrop shaped blister behind the spinner. Note, no bulges on the cowling there either.
It is a standard F.IX as it fits the designation. Merlin 63 engine, 'c' wings.
However, it is also a conversion from the Vc. This is readily identifiable from the cannon bulges, the elevators, the identification light, all of which has been discussed previously in this thread, so doesnt need a recap here.
There is no nomenclature differentiation between Vc conversions and new build IXs so it is a standard F.IX, but without the refinements applied to the later new build F.IXs.
The only serial i can determine from the aircraft on page 5 is the 611 Sqn a/c coded FY-V, and I think the serial is probably BS451, and which is stated in Spitfire The History as a V Conversion.
The nose shots on page 6 are also Vc conversions, easy way to tell on those is the teardrop shaped blister behind the spinner. Note, no bulges on the cowling there either.
05.02.2009, 22:55
BS451 was build under contract number 3393 at Eastleigh and made its first flight on 15 Sept 42. Build as a MK IX, she was damaged at 3 Oct 42 while belonging to 402 Squadron. After repairs she was transfered to 611 Squadron on 29 Nov 42.
The original order was placed for 979 Vc, but this was reallocated in to 139 LF VIII, 378 IX and 462 Seafire II on 27 Jul 42.
The original order was placed for 979 Vc, but this was reallocated in to 139 LF VIII, 378 IX and 462 Seafire II on 27 Jul 42.
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