[Sneeke]

That might be because the ones that had those problems never lived to talk about it

I dont think so. This moments (over mach 1 aerodynamics and control) very well cleared in flight instruction of 15bis (1950), and thre is no deadly probs with it, but some non serious troubles are in.

As for the weapons, they were lethal, I wonder if they would have been better off with 4 23mm instead though. Having 2 different guns means two entirely different trajectories and it makes the sighting difficult.

According to pilots who have combat clashes and kills in Korea, they have only ONE (!) fire button for hole battery, and dont have any ballistics/sightning problems.

The sights themselves were not very good either by the standards of what the americans were using. In terms of reloading, the pod system was well thought out and made life easier.

Agree here.

It is very well documented that there were production quality control issues with the Mig15's. Having to manually adjust wing tabs on the ground to try and trim the AC is not a sign of good control in production.

This issues was partitionaly sloved by test flights, where every pilot learn to deal with his own plane.

Not that it matters much, but the gun cameras were just AWEFUL too.. and the Soviets granted kills based on what the photo evidence showed..if the cross hairs were where they thought they should be on the target they assumed kills..not a great way to score AC.

For VVS pilots kills only can be confirmed with crushed plane on controlled territory, or (very rare) by witnesses.

[JG14_Jagr]

[I dont think so. This moments (over mach 1 aerodynamics and control) very well cleared in flight instruction of 15bis (1950), and thre is no deadly probs with it, but some non serious troubles are in.

According to pilots who have combat clashes and kills in Korea, they have only ONE (!) fire button for hole battery, and dont have any ballistics/sightning problems.

For VVS pilots kills only can be confirmed with crushed plane on controlled territory, or (very rare) by witnesses

I've seen the video of wind tunnel tests.. the Mig15 had MAJOR control surface problems near Mach 1. (as would any plane with that tail design) Thats not a matter of opinion, its a matter of the air flow and the shockwave effect. 1 fire button fires 2 guns with one rate of fire and ballistic behavior and a thrid with totally different rate of fire and ballistic trajectory. Its very difficult to calibrate that with those variables. I've seen the claim report where a VVS pilot claimed a Mig and was awarded 2 others he did not claim due to the gun camera photo's that the intel weenies figured would have resulted in kills based on the gunnery solution

[Sneeke]

I've seen the video of wind tunnel tests.. the Mig15 had MAJOR control surface problems near Mach 1. (as would any plane with that tail design) Thats not a matter of opinion, its a matter of the air flow and the shockwave effect.

You right, thats not a matter of opinion, and in technical instruction/flight manual of MiG-15bis, i haven't read about any controll troubles which can't be slowed by the trained pilot.

1 fire button fires 2 guns with one rate of fire and ballistic behavior and a thrid with totally different rate of fire and ballistic trajectory. Its very difficult to calibrate that with those variables.

I personally prefer different triggers for any type, cose of ammo usage. But the pilot who told this thing was pretty happy with one

I've seen the claim report where a VVS pilot claimed a Mig and was awarded 2 others he did not claim due to the gun camera photo's that the intel weenies figured would have resulted in kills based on the gunnery solution

May be this one of rare. Many MiG pilots in Korea told the same thing: "no fragments on the ground - no victory".

[narvik]

PeterD, please check this post by Sneeke:

Hi Gents! First off all I want to thank Peter and other folks who made this great Korean addition for Il-2.
But i disagree some things whith current MiG incarnation, mostly about auto-brakes, there is no word about it in aircraft manual and pilots memories, so could some one post sourse from where this thing goes.
Thanks again for this great crafts (I realy like erly jets era)
BTW here is links to the manual in russian, whith lots of information inc large M numbers controls:
http://ifolder.ru/14608804
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KCEHTIB2
http://rapidshare.com/files/296010081/m ... o.zip.html

There are a lot of information about results of test flights of MiG-15 and MiG-15bis at beyond-crytical speeds (with a lot of charts). If it's needed, I'll make some translation.
Thanks, Sneeke.

[Sneeke]

Thanks, Sneeke.

NP mate

[PeterD]

PeterD, please check this post by Sneeke:

Hi Gents! First off all I want to thank Peter and other folks who made this great Korean addition for Il-2.
But i disagree some things whith current MiG incarnation, mostly about auto-brakes, there is no word about it in aircraft manual and pilots memories, so could some one post sourse from where this thing goes.
Thanks again for this great crafts (I realy like erly jets era)
BTW here is links to the manual in russian, whith lots of information inc large M numbers controls:
http://ifolder.ru/14608804
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KCEHTIB2
http://rapidshare.com/files/296010081/m ... o.zip.html

There are a lot of information about results of test flights of MiG-15 and MiG-15bis at beyond-crytical speeds (with a lot of charts). If it's needed, I'll make some translation.
Thanks, Sneeke.

Thanks a lot for the links. I'm looking at it don't worry

[Sneeke]

Hi Peter! If some translation needed I will try to help too.

[Aviar]

There is in fact quite a serious weapons bug on the F-86A-5. I did not find it myself but read about it on another thread. After testing it myself, I'm simply reporting it here.

The problem is with the bombs deployment. If a human tries to release the bombs with their normal 'drop bombs' command, nothing will happen. In order to release the bombs, the human will need to use their 'fire rockets' command.

Now, this is not the worst bug in the world and can probably be easily fixed. However, there is another side of this bug which can be more problematic.

You see, a more disturbing problem occurs when the F-86 AI tries to attack a target with bombs. Basically, it attacks the target as if it has rockets, not bombs. We have all seen how the AI attacks with rockets. It will dive down at the target, first fire it's guns at it, and then when it is close to the target, fire it's rockets.

Well, this is what the F-86 is doing. Of course, instead of firing rockets (which it doesn't have), it drops it's bombs. However, by then the plane is so low and close to the target that the bomb blast very badly damages or even destroys the plane itself. Not to mention that the bombs do not even come close to the target.

It's obvious that the F-86 sees the bombs as rockets and responds only to your rocket commands as well as using it's AI rocket routine.

Now that this obvious bug has been reported, I'm sure PeterD will eventually fix it.

*If anyone is interested in viewing a simple test mission, I posted one below. Watch the F-86 'bomb' incorrectly and then switch over to the F-51 and watch the AI bomb normally.:

[MAIN]
MAP Empty4b/load.ini
TIME 12.0
CloudType 0
CloudHeight 1000.0
army 1
playerNum 0
[RespawnTime]
Bigship 1800
Ship 1800
Aeroanchored 1800
Artillery 1800
Searchlight 1800
[Wing]
r0100
B_8AF_096BG_337BS00
[r0100]
Planes 1
OnlyAI 1
Skill 3
Class air.F_86A5
Fuel 50
weapons 2x1000lbs
[r0100_Way]
NORMFLY 3999.26 23899.85 400.00 500.00 &0
NORMFLY 16201.10 23899.31 400.00 500.00 &0
GATTACK 28180.02 23899.94 400.00 500.00 0_Static 0 &0
NORMFLY 34900.16 30707.51 400.00 500.00 &0
NORMFLY 23173.33 47104.79 400.00 500.00 &0
[B_8AF_096BG_337BS00]
Planes 1
OnlyAI 1
Skill 3
numberOn0 0
Class air.F_51D30NA
Fuel 50
weapons 4xM2_APIT_2x1000
[B_8AF_096BG_337BS00_Way]
NORMFLY 3999.30 23425.37 400.00 500.00 &0
NORMFLY 16199.50 23521.31 400.00 500.00 &0
GATTACK 28182.87 23531.51 400.00 500.00 1_Static 0 &0
NORMFLY 38938.72 16738.76 400.00 500.00 &0
NORMFLY 21882.92 7640.38 400.00 500.00 &0
[NStationary]
0_Static vehicles.stationary.Stationary$Wagon2 2 28200.10 23899.66 630.00 0.0
1_Static vehicles.stationary.Stationary$Wagon2 2 28200.63 23531.31 630.00 0.0
[Buildings]
[Bridge]
[House]


Aviar

[PeterD]

Yep... nice catch. I'll fix this and other stuff soon

[benitomuso]

Hi Peter,

thanks for your additions, the Mig is great. The F-86, as some have already stated, still requires some adjustment.

I have seen this strange behavior:

My Ju-88s in both versions, bomber and torpedo, when in land, before take-off start to give some jumps aparently due to tailwheel sudden and violent impulses (you can see the weel going from one side to the other), and the bumps finally destroy the plane and made the explosives blow.

At the beginning it was hard to me to determine what was going on, but after putting a - before the F86A5 Folder and removing it from the air.ini, the Ju-88 recovered perfectly. So, there should be some class that produce an interference with a class of the Ju-88 (and perhaps of other planes too).

Another thing:

It seems that your automatic installers of both the Mig 15 bis and the F86A5, when adding the data to the air.ini and plane_ru.properties, it adds the lines to the original one and not to the already existing in the MODS\STD folder. It erases all your previous planes added. It is true that it creates a backup, but it happened to me (and probably to many) that after installing the Mig you instantly install the F86 and you only have a .bak file with the changes added by your previous plane and you finally lost everything previous you had in your planes files.

Thanks for everything.

[PeterD]

Hi Peter,

thanks for your additions, the Mig is great. The F-86, as some have already stated, still requires some adjustment.

I have seen this strange behavior:

My Ju-88s in both versions, bomber and torpedo, when in land, before take-off start to give some jumps aparently due to tailwheel sudden and violent impulses (you can see the weel going from one side to the other), and the bumps finally destroy the plane and made the explosives blow.

At the beginning it was hard to me to determine what was going on, but after putting a - before the F86A5 Folder and removing it from the air.ini, the Ju-88 recovered perfectly. So, there should be some class that produce an interference with a class of the Ju-88 (and perhaps of other planes too).

Another thing:

It seems that your automatic installers of both the Mig 15 bis and the F86A5, when adding the data to the air.ini and plane_ru.properties, it adds the lines to the original one and not to the already existing in the MODS\STD folder. It erases all your previous planes added. It is true that it creates a backup, but it happened to me (and probably to many) that after installing the Mig you instantly install the F86 and you only have a .bak file with the changes added by your previous plane and you finally lost everything previous you had in your planes files.

Thanks for everything.

No idea about the the Ju-88, I'll have a look but I doubt it has any influence. The installer does add the planes to the existing air.ini, plane_ru and weapons_ru.properties that are located in MODS\STD\, it will only ask to create a new air.ini if it only finds plane_ru and weapons_ru in MODS\STD\ (typical case: the person that just installed Mod activator 5.2). In any case it is true that after installing the second plane the backup is completely pointless, however it shouldn't destroy anything that was previously working AFAIK, the worst it can happen is that the list it sorted alphabetically. Next autoinstaller will make up to 999 backups before it asks to clean up or continue doing even more backups

[fido]

nice job Peter, altough drop tanks for mig would be nice

[TinyTim]

Having 2 different guns means two entirely different trajectories and it makes the sighting difficult.

Well, NS-23 and N-37 actually have amazingly similar muzzle velocities (and thus trajectories) - 690m/s.

[Aviar]

I don't see any problem here at all. The three guns are NOT linked together, in firing nor convergence. Although technically, all 3 guns are cannons, the two 23mm's are controlled by your Weapon 1 command. The 37mm is controlled by your Weapon 2 command.

So, you can apply the convergence for the 23mm's using the 'Machine Guns' setting. The convergence for the 37mm is applied using the 'Cannons' setting.

Aviar

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Not a bug, just some test info

I took the time to generate the data files for IL2C. Here is the link

http://www.flightsimtesting.com/fst/il2 ... _MiG15.zip

Just unzip it into your IL2C directory

From that I did a few screen captures

TURN TIMES

At speeds less than 350kph (217mph) @ 1,000m (3,280ft) the F86 turns better than the MiG15, for example at 310kph it takes the F86 ~31.9 seconds and the MiG15 takes ~33.0 seconds

RATE OF CLIMB

At all altitudes the MiG15 climbs better than the F86. Note the MiGs climb rate of 65m/s (12795 ft/min) is almost twice that of the F86 at 40m/s (7874 ft/min) so do NOT try and climb with the MiG in your 86 unless you got alot more e than he has, and even than for only short periods.

SPEED

At all altitudes the F86 is faster than the MiG15

PS this data was collected on Bury's STD map so direct comparisons can be made to real world data in STD format.

Thanks to SJack and Bury for their mods and maps! And PeterD for these great mods!!