28.05.2008, 04:19
Certainly not the greatest ever but I like it :wink:
"Bismarck Sighted"
![[Image: BismarckSightedFixedSwas.jpg]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj238/hankjensen/BismarckSightedFixedSwas.jpg)
"Bismarck Sighted"
For Shooter: Repost
28.05.2008, 05:26
Of course, Luftwaffe fans don't care for it much. Reminds them of how the Big Kahuna went down. :wink:
28.05.2008, 13:06
"Big Kahura" went down after cutting on two peaces the HMS Hood,with single hit,which was scored in the 3rd salvo ever fired in this battle by Bismark.And sinking it for less than 1:50 min,and only 3 sailors servived.And badly damaging the second british ship there,HMS Prince of Wales,which terrified when observing the fast death of the Royal NAVY's proud and his battle brother,turned back to England and pumped out black smoke of his chimneys,trying to escape.
And when the finnal battle was already fact,and the Bismark was surrounded and fighting with 7-8 (maybe more) brittish ships,he fought and fired and fired untill his last cannon section was already submerged and the power plant and power supply went down.
I can only say....Respect to the thousands men crew of Bismark,who have died in a battle,that was already clear that they cannot win.They staied on their battle stations untill the last round and power supply.
The last brittish destoyers that went to make a torpedo run on Bismark, made it with such a respect,caution and fear even when it was already clear that Bismark is sinking and is badly damaged and the entire deck was on fire.
It's now already being world wide acknowledged,that there was no other ship,that fought so bravely like Bismark,and no other ship made such a last stand.
NB
Only Yamato made such a thing,but Yamato was sent on a kamikaze mission,and Bismark not.Bismark's mission was not to try to get him self killed.)
Cocnlusion:
Talk for Bismark with respect,people.The thousands of men that 've found their last way on that ship,and died there,must have our respect.
And when the finnal battle was already fact,and the Bismark was surrounded and fighting with 7-8 (maybe more) brittish ships,he fought and fired and fired untill his last cannon section was already submerged and the power plant and power supply went down.
I can only say....Respect to the thousands men crew of Bismark,who have died in a battle,that was already clear that they cannot win.They staied on their battle stations untill the last round and power supply.
The last brittish destoyers that went to make a torpedo run on Bismark, made it with such a respect,caution and fear even when it was already clear that Bismark is sinking and is badly damaged and the entire deck was on fire.
It's now already being world wide acknowledged,that there was no other ship,that fought so bravely like Bismark,and no other ship made such a last stand.
NB
Only Yamato made such a thing,but Yamato was sent on a kamikaze mission,and Bismark not.Bismark's mission was not to try to get him self killed.)Cocnlusion:
Talk for Bismark with respect,people.The thousands of men that 've found their last way on that ship,and died there,must have our respect.
28.05.2008, 13:23
Mate, you are wrong. The Prince of Wales wasn't sunk in the battle... :roll:
It was the HMS Hood (battlecruiser) which was sunk, just as you wrote.
Regards.
It was the HMS Hood (battlecruiser) which was sunk, just as you wrote.
Regards.
28.05.2008, 13:27
Ah yes.....Sorry..Silly mistake...
I'm a bit tired now...Thinking of Hood,and writing Prince of Wales... :lol:
I'm a bit tired now...Thinking of Hood,and writing Prince of Wales... :lol:
28.05.2008, 13:43
I have respect for the men but NOT for the ship or it's intended purpose. The Nazi regime tasked it with the mission of sinking allied merchant ships carrying supplies to England in hopes that Hitler would prevail. Perhaps he would have if Bismarck had survived to carry out her intended purpose.
As regards sea battles and fighting bravely, perhaps you should acquaint yourself with one known as John Paul Jones, also known as the father of the United States Navy.
As regards sea battles and fighting bravely, perhaps you should acquaint yourself with one known as John Paul Jones, also known as the father of the United States Navy.
28.05.2008, 20:16
Nice shot Shadow 
err FatBoy 
almost if not fotoreal, the clouds look excellent in turn bringing out the colorings of the Cat, very nice choice of subject matter too, most excellent mate
Hope were not falling out over battleships chaps, the concencus of opinion from war studiers , theorists and Boffs in the know, is that the battlesShip was obsolete before hostilities even began between any nation, I have to agree with them, events at Pearl Harbor and the later destruction of the Japanes fleet both by Carrier Borne Air power proved this beyond any doubt,in addition on the european front the effectiveness of The Bismark, Prince Eugen, Scharnhorst & the Tirpitz on allied shipping in WW2 was negligable, U Boat wolfpacks reigned supreme proving again that Battleships were indeed the behemoths of a bygone era.
I also believe that the numerous allied failed attempts to sink the Tirpitz, were a waste of good men and resources, the ship never posed any real threat to the allied forces or shipping, as for the Bismark, how lucky were the Royal Navy? Typical Brit bloody mindedness, stiff upper lip & big balls were all that won the day, had the Bismarks Captain not mistakenly believed that a larger British force was waiting for him, I think things would have been very different for the Royal Navy, the victory written in history could have easily been a disaster the Royal Navy could ill afford to have occur at such an early Juncture in the war.
Having said all that, The men that took part in the Bismark action all have my admiration, their bravery & sacrifices made whilst taking on such a Goliath is commendable and they all deserve their place in history
Regards Shooter
err FatBoy almost if not fotoreal, the clouds look excellent in turn bringing out the colorings of the Cat, very nice choice of subject matter too, most excellent mate Hope were not falling out over battleships chaps, the concencus of opinion from war studiers , theorists and Boffs in the know, is that the battlesShip was obsolete before hostilities even began between any nation, I have to agree with them, events at Pearl Harbor and the later destruction of the Japanes fleet both by Carrier Borne Air power proved this beyond any doubt,in addition on the european front the effectiveness of The Bismark, Prince Eugen, Scharnhorst & the Tirpitz on allied shipping in WW2 was negligable, U Boat wolfpacks reigned supreme proving again that Battleships were indeed the behemoths of a bygone era.
I also believe that the numerous allied failed attempts to sink the Tirpitz, were a waste of good men and resources, the ship never posed any real threat to the allied forces or shipping, as for the Bismark, how lucky were the Royal Navy? Typical Brit bloody mindedness, stiff upper lip & big balls were all that won the day, had the Bismarks Captain not mistakenly believed that a larger British force was waiting for him, I think things would have been very different for the Royal Navy, the victory written in history could have easily been a disaster the Royal Navy could ill afford to have occur at such an early Juncture in the war.
Having said all that, The men that took part in the Bismark action all have my admiration, their bravery & sacrifices made whilst taking on such a Goliath is commendable and they all deserve their place in history
Regards Shooter
29.05.2008, 05:10
Thanks, M8! Lots of ways I could improve it but I felt that it's good enough and I don't feel like putting a lot of time into images very often. :wink:
The whole thing with the Bismarck was pretty much astounding luck for the Brits. That's part of what makes the story so interesting. The one thing I DON"T like is that, IMHO, the British ships picking up German survivors shoved off and left a lot of those men to die in the water of exposure. Not very British.
Excuses were given but they sound like excuses. I think that they were just angry over the Hood. Still no excuse :!:
That's why I won't make any images of the SINKING of Bismarck. Too many German sailors died needlessly in the cold water AFTER the sinking, AFTER the battle was over. That's not war, that's not battle, that's not noble! That was simply inhumane. I've heard first hand accounts from German sailors who survived so I know what went on from their point of view and I believe what they say.
Anyway, that's why I made an image of Bismarck being sighted instead of an image of her being attacked and sunk. A lot of the Luftwaffe fans immediately jumped to conclusions about this image. That's always easier than finding out the facts. When they do that I'm not going to explain things. Let them think what they want to think but there's a reason why I went to the trouble of doing research and making this sighting image instead of a sinking image.
Bismarck was a Big Kahuna. Big, big, big! That's also part of why she is still so well remembered today. There are a lot of high end model kits of Bismarck and she's currently quite popular with modellers.
Sinking of ships was part of WWII. That part is acceptable as ships were sunk and lives lost that way on both sides. What is NOT acceptable is to allow surviors to die in the water for no good reason! That's why I'll NEVER make an image of the sinking of Bismarck. I know what happened after she went down. It was shameful.
The whole thing with the Bismarck was pretty much astounding luck for the Brits. That's part of what makes the story so interesting. The one thing I DON"T like is that, IMHO, the British ships picking up German survivors shoved off and left a lot of those men to die in the water of exposure. Not very British.
Excuses were given but they sound like excuses. I think that they were just angry over the Hood. Still no excuse :!: That's why I won't make any images of the SINKING of Bismarck. Too many German sailors died needlessly in the cold water AFTER the sinking, AFTER the battle was over. That's not war, that's not battle, that's not noble! That was simply inhumane. I've heard first hand accounts from German sailors who survived so I know what went on from their point of view and I believe what they say.
Anyway, that's why I made an image of Bismarck being sighted instead of an image of her being attacked and sunk. A lot of the Luftwaffe fans immediately jumped to conclusions about this image. That's always easier than finding out the facts. When they do that I'm not going to explain things. Let them think what they want to think but there's a reason why I went to the trouble of doing research and making this sighting image instead of a sinking image.
Bismarck was a Big Kahuna. Big, big, big! That's also part of why she is still so well remembered today. There are a lot of high end model kits of Bismarck and she's currently quite popular with modellers.
Sinking of ships was part of WWII. That part is acceptable as ships were sunk and lives lost that way on both sides. What is NOT acceptable is to allow surviors to die in the water for no good reason! That's why I'll NEVER make an image of the sinking of Bismarck. I know what happened after she went down. It was shameful.
29.05.2008, 05:42
Hello Fatboy, I dont know where you got that story from mate, bout the Brits sinking Bismark, examination of the wreck apparantly has proven beyond doubt that she was actually scuttled by her crew as was the Graf Spee?
As far leaving sailors in the water mate, thats sea warfare, ships rarely stopped to pick up survivors, often for good reason, torpedo attacks and them being sunk themselves,however lets not forget no survivors were ever picked up by German U Boats after the sinkings of 100s perhaps more than 1000 allied ships in WWII as a matter of course?
Regards Shooter
As far leaving sailors in the water mate, thats sea warfare, ships rarely stopped to pick up survivors, often for good reason, torpedo attacks and them being sunk themselves,however lets not forget no survivors were ever picked up by German U Boats after the sinkings of 100s perhaps more than 1000 allied ships in WWII as a matter of course?
Regards Shooter
29.05.2008, 05:44
Why are you saying that Luftwaffe fans don't like it, just because its a German ship about to be sunk? Maybe they just don't like the image itself?
29.05.2008, 06:33
:lol: :lol: :lol:
No, mate, that controversy is NOT resolved. :wink:
Well, this is a repost, Riga. There were comments in the first post but none about it not being a good image. It was noted when I first posted it that the swastika was backward, which I could care less about since that is a Nazi symbol. Nevertheless, I fixed it.
Also, Riga, it isn't about to be sunk. That's the point. She is only sighted. After that the British ships had to try to catch her. Then, of course, there was the aerial bombardment with only the very last bomb doing anything to impede Bismarck. So it was quite a while after she was spotted that she was engaged and finally sunk.
As regards surviors, Shooter, the British actually did pick up survivors but then took off before they got them all. There was no pressing reason to move off before finishing the job.
No, mate, that controversy is NOT resolved. :wink:
Well, this is a repost, Riga. There were comments in the first post but none about it not being a good image. It was noted when I first posted it that the swastika was backward, which I could care less about since that is a Nazi symbol. Nevertheless, I fixed it.
Also, Riga, it isn't about to be sunk. That's the point. She is only sighted. After that the British ships had to try to catch her. Then, of course, there was the aerial bombardment with only the very last bomb doing anything to impede Bismarck. So it was quite a while after she was spotted that she was engaged and finally sunk.
As regards surviors, Shooter, the British actually did pick up survivors but then took off before they got them all. There was no pressing reason to move off before finishing the job.
29.05.2008, 06:50
Hi mate, I made a comment prior to my blathering on about the Bismarck for what must have seemed like an eternity :oops: Hehe
:Nice shot Shadow err FatBoy almost if not fotoreal, the clouds look excellent in turn bringing out the colorings of the Cat, very nice choice of subject matter too, most excellent mate
Also I got your PM mate, didnt reply as yet as time was a factor and it takes me ages to formulate responses to PMs, them being personal you see, plus dont want to come across like some sort of Screeny Art site nincompoop Arty Fartry Wannabe
Regards Shooter
:Nice shot Shadow
err FatBoy almost if not fotoreal, the clouds look excellent in turn bringing out the colorings of the Cat, very nice choice of subject matter too, most excellent mate Also I got your PM mate, didnt reply as yet as time was a factor and it takes me ages to formulate responses to PMs, them being personal you see, plus dont want to come across like some sort of Screeny Art site nincompoop Arty Fartry Wannabe
Regards Shooter
29.05.2008, 09:13
Kriegsmarine weren't nazis.That's official stated even durring WW2 by Hitler himself.They weren't obligated to call themselves "Nazi's".
How Bismark got caught and sunk..:
1-Bismark was badly hit erlier this day by a lucky torpedo shot,by one of the Swordfishes that menaged to score some hit on the ship on their second attack run.
2-This hit demaged the rudder of the ship at 38-45 degrees to port left of the ship (if i remember well),which was making very fast and steep maneuvers to evade the torpedos.
3-Bismark sent ---...--- (SOS) to the high commands of the Kriegsmarine,asking for help and giving out his cordinates.
4-At the time of transmitting,the message was intercepted by mistake by the brits.
5-Bismark is staying dead in the water,unabled to stear forward for the nearest navy base in Normany.And waiting for help.
6-Kriegsmarine's HQ is sending a group of U-boats for the area where Bismark is,to try to help out of the ship.Because the U-boats could reach the area faster than any other battle ship,and the ship was out of the range of any Luftwaffe plane.
7-The mighty "Dirty cat" is seeing the ship,staying at one place,when the fog is comming up a little.
8-The "mighty" Royal Navy,finds the ship,which was handicaped,and had to fight alone with 7-8,maybe more brittish ships.
9-The battle is on,Bismark is fighting bravely even when it's already clear that even if he menage to sink all of the brit's ships somehow,he won't be able to move out of the area,and search for cover.
10-Bismark is badly demaged.The crew is sinking the ship,to prevent eventual try for invading the ship by the brits.Because Bismark was equiped with the last innovated models of radar systems,electrical systems,arming systems,etc.And by this time,neither the Johny's,neither the Tommy's had this technology.
11-The ship have sunk.The royal navy is celebrating that they menaged to sink a ship( as i said they thought that...It was sinked by it's own crew),which fought against 8 or even more of their ships.
12-The help arrives,but it's there for nothing....The ship's gone...The servivors too.
The captain of the Bismark was a damn fine man...There are stories like this..Sometimes he went down in the engine rooms,to help to the mechanicians and to rise up their moral.
Also he was an excellent strategy planner.If the rudder of his boat wasn't jammed....He was about to get his ship out of there for a day,and to save his crew...Beneath the noses of the royal navy.
Bismark was caught by chance.
ps:The swastika wasn't innovated by Hitler or his gouvernement.
The eagle and the swastika were innovated thousands of years in the past,by the generals of the Rome Emripe,which selected this insignia for a mark for the battle flags of the Rome Empire's legions.So if you see a swastika,this doesn't mean only "Hitler-NAZI-Hitler-Nazi" .If you think only this,then i can only say that you're a very wrong informed man.
Hitler was very interested in the history.Don't you know that he collected all of the historical art creations that he met???
So he probably saw the swastika somewhere in the books,and liked it a lot...And here we are...We have the history of the "nazy" flag.
ps2:There are only 4 well knows ships in the world even today.They are:
Bismark and Tirpitz;Yamato and Musashi.
Those beasts didn't had equal ship from allied side.Even today...there was never created a bigger battleship than those beasts...
How Bismark got caught and sunk..:
1-Bismark was badly hit erlier this day by a lucky torpedo shot,by one of the Swordfishes that menaged to score some hit on the ship on their second attack run.
2-This hit demaged the rudder of the ship at 38-45 degrees to port left of the ship (if i remember well),which was making very fast and steep maneuvers to evade the torpedos.
3-Bismark sent ---...--- (SOS) to the high commands of the Kriegsmarine,asking for help and giving out his cordinates.
4-At the time of transmitting,the message was intercepted by mistake by the brits.
5-Bismark is staying dead in the water,unabled to stear forward for the nearest navy base in Normany.And waiting for help.
6-Kriegsmarine's HQ is sending a group of U-boats for the area where Bismark is,to try to help out of the ship.Because the U-boats could reach the area faster than any other battle ship,and the ship was out of the range of any Luftwaffe plane.
7-The mighty "Dirty cat" is seeing the ship,staying at one place,when the fog is comming up a little.
8-The "mighty" Royal Navy,finds the ship,which was handicaped,and had to fight alone with 7-8,maybe more brittish ships.
9-The battle is on,Bismark is fighting bravely even when it's already clear that even if he menage to sink all of the brit's ships somehow,he won't be able to move out of the area,and search for cover.
10-Bismark is badly demaged.The crew is sinking the ship,to prevent eventual try for invading the ship by the brits.Because Bismark was equiped with the last innovated models of radar systems,electrical systems,arming systems,etc.And by this time,neither the Johny's,neither the Tommy's had this technology.
11-The ship have sunk.The royal navy is celebrating that they menaged to sink a ship( as i said they thought that...It was sinked by it's own crew),which fought against 8 or even more of their ships.
12-The help arrives,but it's there for nothing....The ship's gone...The servivors too.
The captain of the Bismark was a damn fine man...There are stories like this..Sometimes he went down in the engine rooms,to help to the mechanicians and to rise up their moral.
Also he was an excellent strategy planner.If the rudder of his boat wasn't jammed....He was about to get his ship out of there for a day,and to save his crew...Beneath the noses of the royal navy.
Bismark was caught by chance.
ps:The swastika wasn't innovated by Hitler or his gouvernement.
The eagle and the swastika were innovated thousands of years in the past,by the generals of the Rome Emripe,which selected this insignia for a mark for the battle flags of the Rome Empire's legions.So if you see a swastika,this doesn't mean only "Hitler-NAZI-Hitler-Nazi" .If you think only this,then i can only say that you're a very wrong informed man.
Hitler was very interested in the history.Don't you know that he collected all of the historical art creations that he met???
So he probably saw the swastika somewhere in the books,and liked it a lot...And here we are...We have the history of the "nazy" flag.
ps2:There are only 4 well knows ships in the world even today.They are:
Bismark and Tirpitz;Yamato and Musashi.
Those beasts didn't had equal ship from allied side.Even today...there was never created a bigger battleship than those beasts...
29.05.2008, 09:24
I think that i moved a "little" bit off the topic's purpose... :lol:
29.05.2008, 09:30
D'ya think? lol
PS: The Swastika symbol has exsisted for some 3000 years which obviously counts out any link to it being devised by the Roman Empire, variations of it appear in many ancient cultures as well as new.
Modern cultures associate it with evil & Nazism due only to its use on a large scale in living memory for some. The Swastika most likely will always evoke thoughts of Nazism and all its evils purely by association as one would recall any other major historical event by associations to it .
eg: US Civil War, one immediately thinks of Flags / Banners, I'm willing to bet cash money that it would be one of the Confederate South and not of Union North.
The more often we see something & its associations or continue to display it for whatever reason the longer it stays burned in memory
Regards Shooter
PS: The Swastika symbol has exsisted for some 3000 years which obviously counts out any link to it being devised by the Roman Empire, variations of it appear in many ancient cultures as well as new.
Modern cultures associate it with evil & Nazism due only to its use on a large scale in living memory for some. The Swastika most likely will always evoke thoughts of Nazism and all its evils purely by association as one would recall any other major historical event by associations to it .
eg: US Civil War, one immediately thinks of Flags / Banners, I'm willing to bet cash money that it would be one of the Confederate South and not of Union North.
The more often we see something & its associations or continue to display it for whatever reason the longer it stays burned in memory
Regards Shooter
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