[Loon]

edit two loons eh, damn that split personality

LOL, I see. There is a small difference, but anyway curious coincidence making this world smaller than it looks to be :wink:

[fozzy]

The day I hear of the FM's being publically changed is the day I quit this game online. Leave the worms in the can please.

[Aymar_Mauri]

So, the same religious dogmas apply here at AAA?

yeh, and i hope it will stay this way..

Even when clear mistakes are in the files such as incorrect wingspan and wingarea for Spitfire and Ta-152C? I have seen the EM and FM data that were extracted by other people.

[Daiichidoku]

id love to see many 'mistakes' corrected, and other thigns happen too

p38: fix compress, and apply to ALL otehr types in game, or remove it from p38
jets: just as they upgrading engine powere "with absolutely no time to spare" with yak1B up power for go 229, it certaily would have recieved uprated jumos, or went to better bmws or hirths
+11 temepst, the most produced type

the list goes on

but as far as that sutff goes, i want that from oleg, nobody else

its wrong to change/play with that stuff

the avenmger was played with, but that a COG/model placement issue, the FM itself was not altered...cases like this i can accept

even if we only found out about the 300kg underweight of LaGGs now, and could easily change the weight to correct values, i WOULDNT want it from mod...i would rather fly 600lbs underweight over-performing LaGG, or fight them, than have a correct mass LaGG from a mod

sounds, skinds, maps, flyables, reticles, all that good stuff..FU oleg

FMs/DMs and that kinda stuff? FU whoever does it

[Aymar_Mauri]

id love to see many 'mistakes' corrected, and other thigns happen too

p38: fix compress, and apply to ALL otehr types in game, or remove it from p38

jets: just as they upgrading engine powere "with absolutely no time to spare" with yak1B up power

for go 229, it certaily would have recieved uprated jumos, or went to better bmws or hirths

+11 temepst, the most produced type

the list goes on

All true.

but as far as that sutff goes, i want that from oleg, nobody else

Guess what? You're not going to get it from him. Oleg is only interested in online gameplay balance, therefore the constant changes in the data due to the online whiners. And I'm not going to mention his never shown "historical sources".

its wrong to change/play with that stuff

the avenmger was played with, but that a COG/model placement issue, the FM itself was not altered...cases like this i can accept

even if we only found out about the 300kg underweight of LaGGs now, and could easily change the weight to correct values, i WOULDNT want it from mod...i would rather fly 600lbs underweight over-performing LaGG, or fight them, than have a correct mass LaGG from a mod

Care to explain why? And please don't mention the online cheating. With the sheer amount of experience and knowledge about airplane performance of most veteran pilots online, cheaters can be easily caught.

This is the ONLY community I've ever seen in ANY game that is a lookalike to the middle ages' inquisition in regard to moding some areas of the game.

isounds, skinds, maps, flyables, reticles, all that good stuff..FU oleg

FMs/DMs and that kinda stuff? FU whoever does it

What you are explaining here is that online balance trumps historical accuracy and that, from my experience reading many forums, is precisely the only thing many of the online players ever wanted. They never actually cared about IL-2 data and performance being up to par with historical data. They just want to be sure their plane is as best as it can be and the enemy's is as wost as it can be.

I've told you already, and you know this very well, that I couln't care less for online. But being unabe to mod EM and FM data for offline campaigns means I'll loose the remaining interest I have in this game since I'll can never start campaigns with the plans that have incorrect data.

[Daiichidoku]

oh, i can see offliners that can do it, doing it..and all the more power to em

if and when i see "corrected" P38 mods, etc, im on them, and will then likely start DL campaigns stuff

i understand yoru sentiments precisely Aymar

but theres no denying, as bad as some ppl ahve gotten over the mod issue, FM tinkering is a hot rock, really hot..the prob is, one guy says "this is correct P38"...5 million others have thier own "correct" P 38

for the overall state of FUBAR-ed-ness among all types in game, id rather have everyone flying the same porked 38, than 42 completely different, yet "correct" 38s

this all applies of course, to online

while there are servers i can go to with CRT=2, and the servers that run 409 (until 409 itself is broken/accessed), i couldnt care less about 2000kph U2s or whatever...i have the optioon of going to "cheat-free" servers to avoid that....whjen i dont mind supersonic biplanes, i go to 408 server and have fun

the prob is, once 409 is beaten, there will be little or no refuge from the spectre of cheating, or at least the threat of it

then we may see some servers going to password format...not good


again, i dont mind the idea that FM tweak/alteration will happen...but i simply cant imagine how it will go down if the time comes when several ppl can and will be seen doing it

i think the game was "good enough" to begin with; the mods have breathed new life into it, i feel its simply not worth the strife over FM crap for the mistakes that do exist in game, having flyables, reticles, maps, etc is more than enough as is

but thats just me 8)

[Daiichidoku]

im distracted atm, sorry for inconcise relpys Aymar


yea, i know oleg has been favorable to early war russian stuff, in the interests of "game balance"...SO lame....so hypocritical...and other "balance" compromises he has made

i always liek to mention his sources...WTF are they? im REALLY interested in where he got his data, and exactly what that data is, for the P 38...when several ppl send him 38 data from both lockheed, and NACA, and dismisses it as "propaganda", i cant imagine what higher power he could get his 38 data from.... :roll:

cheaters easily caught? yes, most of them...there will always be losers with outreageous planes...its the crafty devils in +25 spits that look liek +18s or mustangIIIs in P51 bodies...VERY difficult to tell from ntrack viewing

that said, iIMO the community will be largely self-policing, and those who do cheat, msot of them will indeed be weeded out

that the game is dead, or will die, is crap...that it will...that it already has changed, no denying

[Vpmedia]

Modifying sounds, map textures, default skins, adding new flyables = extending life of Il2.

Modifying FM's and DM's = death of Il2.

+1

[F22-Raptor-2006]

well if u ever did want oleg to do something about it contact them since they registered a few days ago with this forum!!!!!!!!! Perhaps u may change oleg's mind hopefully anyway.

[ROSOBORONEXPORTCORP]

So, the same religious dogmas apply here at AAA?

yeh, and i hope it will stay this way..

Even when clear mistakes are in the files such as incorrect wingspan and wingarea for Spitfire and Ta-152C? I have seen the EM and FM data that were extracted by other people.

This is what worries me. Oleg may well be entering the data in a specific way for the engine (eg. true wing area vs. a calculation based on approximate airflow patterns over the wing). All that it takes is an uniformed person who thinks that the FW-190 should be able to out turn a spitfire at all points in its envelope or that the La-7 is overmodeled...

The only changes proposed are based on the 1946 manual and would undo some inaccuracies which are admitted to and documented by Luthier's and Oleg Maddox's teams. All that I am suggesting really is to reduce the RTD-1's thrust from 600kg to 500kg.

The exception is, of course, the X-4. The loadout for the Ta-183 is almost certainly unrealistic. The Ar-234 would be a more likely platform. Of course the X-4 was never deployed in combat so perhaps the Arado, which was deployed in combat, should be left alone.

As for the outer wing racks on the Arado: They produce too much drag. In real life almost all Arado sorties took place with only one 250kg or 500kg bomb on the centerline. If possible I will only add these single bomb rack options (leaving the overloaded ones alone).

Daiichidoku, the Ho-229 had the engines buried in the fuselage and would never have received uprated engines. The only related design with this flexibility is the Gotha P.60 series. I agree with your reluctance for obvious reasons.

[Skunkmeister]

Are you sure it isnt just some smartass who registered with his name?

[Skunkmeister]

ROSOBORONEXPORTCORP, where do you get this information that the Ar234 would have had X-4's and not the Ta-183?

As has been said, the Ar234 was developped as a bomber, and the variant that we have in this game is just that, a bomber. It has no forward firing armament, and it does not have a sight to help guide the X-4.

[Sojka]

well if u ever did want oleg to do something about it contact them since they registered a few days ago with this forum!!!!!!!!! Perhaps u may change oleg's mind hopefully anyway.

hehe that will be some funny person.. not Oleg..
would be a nice joke if that member would became the best modder..

[F22-Raptor-2006]

well we can get jolly to look at his email address and we may get a better indication cos only admins can do that

[Bandit Bill]

The exception is, of course, the X-4. The loadout for the Ta-183 is almost certainly unrealistic. The Ar-234 would be a more likely platform. Of course the X-4 was never deployed in combat so perhaps the Arado, which was deployed in combat, should be left alone.

Considering the Arado's mission envelope in real life, a more realistic missile would have been the Fritz-X radio controlled missile (carried by the HE-111 and FW200 IRL) - if the Ar-234 had provisions for two crew members. The X-4 was tested with the FW-190, but due to control issues of the pilot needing to control both the airplane and the missile, it was subsequently tested on multi-crew A/C ( JU-88 ) before wars end.

In other words, OM's use of the missile on the TA-152 and the TA-183 were unrealistic, as it would be too on the Ar-234 as a hack

Quick background information pulled from Wikipedia - i'm not responsible for factual inaccuracies