[Chaoic16]

so,Chaoic16, do you think think that experiments should be worked on BEFORE realism then? is that what you are saying?
happily , i think the integrity of the modelers will overcome the desire for what if scenarios

I never said that, you are assuming thing on your own... No offense but you sound like closed-minded person. What I was saying is that both should come together at the same time, NOT before each other! I never even said that one should be before each other in my speech.


Chaoic out...

[Chaoic16]

ok, so "what if" ?

what if arms developers invented a warp drive? extreme i know but thats how far it could be taken, aint it.
maybe we need the volkswaffe http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QbL1_oRCd ... re=related

i repeat, il2 is meant to be a historically correct ww2 flight simulation, the fact that olegg decided to put in a couple of experimental planes does NOT suggest that it should be law that more cr*p should be made. i say if you want to play with "what if" and "experiments" then go play garys mod or xwing or something, adding these planes would simply destroy the realism and historical correctness of this fine SIMULATION.
ppl can argue the toss forever and a day on this one but the facts still stand!!!!!

ohh, and for the record, i am working on the japanese airforce, i have already started construction on 2 projects( both historical) and will be submitting them in due course to AAA for fm/dm attachment.

Excuse me? I find it VERY insulting when you said "x wing' or gmod. These are not simulator and is not designed as WWII simulator so your argument on that are seriously flawed. It have NOTHING TO DO with this arguement! You are refusing to realize it. It is already possible to find realistic FM for experimental and 'what if plane. Wrap drive have nothng to do with this also.

However, now you are seeing WHY Oleg added 'what if' planes in first place, that is becuase I am willing to bet he was wondering what would it have been like to experience these experimental and 'what if' planes that have been flown in WWII, therefore seeing how it have affected WWII at end if WWII kept going on for other years. And that is what I call it, "Alternative history" in realistic way. So take your time to read my whole speech again because you kept sounding like you are assuming thing or concluding thing on your own which went against my previous post.


Chaoic out...

[Chaoic16]

ok, so "what if" ?

what if arms developers invented a warp drive? extreme i know but thats how far it could be taken, aint it.
maybe we need the volkswaffe http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QbL1_oRCd ... re=related

i repeat, il2 is meant to be a historically correct ww2 flight simulation, the fact that olegg decided to put in a couple of experimental planes does NOT suggest that it should be law that more cr*p should be made. i say if you want to play with "what if" and "experiments" then go play garys mod or xwing or something, adding these planes would simply destroy the realism and historical correctness of this fine SIMULATION.
ppl can argue the toss forever and a day on this one but the facts still stand!!!!!

ohh, and for the record, i am working on the japanese airforce, i have already started construction on 2 projects( both historical) and will be submitting them in due course to AAA for fm/dm attachment.

I completely agree with you, Danger.

This love affair with wet-dream Waffe and '46 types will take the sim in a very bad direction if it is allowed to continue. It is nothing more than a training ground for future cheats and the UFO's that the anti-mod crowd have been predicting all year. :evil:

I disagree with you wholeheartly there. You dont get it, the experimental and 'what if' of all nation planes, not only german's would bring an alternative history to WWII simulator of IL-2 1946 which is why Oleg added some of 1946 in first place. It have nothing to do with cheating because it is 'simulator' of add-on and you acted like these are cheating which they are NOT! It's called Alternative history.

IF someone edited orginial IL-2 and tweak it then turn it into UFO for online, then that is cheating which we are against. But adding an alternative history of aircraft (experimental and 'what if') have nothing to do with that!


Chaoic out...

[fly_zo]

.... i really don't see why all this fuss , guys from AAA team will choose which project they prefer , anyway .
I hate to bring it out but decision what will get produced it's not really on community desires but rather on interests and willingness of modders ....it's only fair cos they are doing it in their own free time after all. :wink:

IMHO, any kind of pushing and lobbing would only produce contra effect ....

regards
Z
p.s.
please don't let this discussion to get out of hands

[goshikisen]

I hate to bring it out but decision what will get produced it's not really on community desires but rather on interests and willingness of modders ....it's only fair cos they are doing it in their own free time after all. :wink:

I guess the key is to match community desire with modders willingness. My concern isn't community "desire" but rather what is needed and what isn't... I'm not a huge fan of the C-46 Commando but if someone made a model of it and included it in the sim no one out there could argue that it was a waste of time or wasn't important OR, for that matter, that it didn't benefit the sim and community.

There's nothing wrong with taking a second and asking yourself "What does the sim really need?"

[fly_zo]

I guess the key is to match community desire with modders willingness. My concern isn't community "desire" but rather what is needed and what isn't...

that is the problem IMHO, who exactly can decide what this sim really needs ? I mean it rather depends on individual interests and desires

I'm not a huge fan of the C-46 Commando but if someone made a model of it and included it in the sim no one out there could argue that it was a waste of time or wasn't important OR, for that matter, that it didn't benefit the sim and community.

agree .... i appreciate any work presented here

There's nothing wrong with taking a second and asking yourself "What does the sim really need?"

yup, but crucial word is "yourself" here .... what i think and someone else thinks doesn't have to be the same and still either of us isn't necessary wrong .

regards
Z

[goshikisen]

yup, but crucial word is "yourself" here .... what i think and someone else thinks doesn't have to be the same and still either of us isn't necessary wrong .

Sorry fly_zo... I meant the rhetorical "yourself". I guess what I'm saying is whether you or I or anyone else likes the Commando (for example) no one can argue that it was important and was produced in great numbers and would benefit the sim.

[Th!rdeye]

These what if planes never flew because they sucked. If they were good, they would have been operational.

Why would we include phased out planes into the game? For a "what if" campaign? If WWII never ended in 45, then i would bet my life that their would be a whole new set of experimental planes and operational planes in the sky. Because that didnt happen, their is NO way you can predict what would have been made. Too many variables to consider.

These experimental planes are just that. Experiments. You do not buy a experiment for your house, you buy a tested and operational product. Same goes for aircraft.

[Th!rdeye]

.... i really don't see why all this fuss , guys from AAA team will choose which project they prefer , anyway .
I hate to bring it out but decision what will get produced it's not really on community desires but rather on interests and willingness of modders ....it's only fair cos they are doing it in their own free time after all. :wink:

IMHO, any kind of pushing and lobbing would only produce contra effect ....

regards
Z
p.s.
please don't let this discussion to get out of hands

I agree. We do what interests us. Now if someone wanted to make a Tie Fighter, or a F-14 Tomcat, then we got a issue.

[Chaoic16]

I need to know if I am banned by accident? I have been unable to get an access to this forum via my computer anymore. I am using my phone internet to go into this internet. ???

[fly_zo]

I need to know if I am banned by accident? I have been unable to get an access to this forum via my computer anymore. I am using my phone internet to go into this internet. ???

nope , you are not on ban list nor your usual ip addresses .... just checked

must be at your end ( or your IPS)

regards
Z

[Chaoic16]

I need to know if I am banned by accident? I have been unable to get an access to this forum via my computer anymore. I am using my phone internet to go into this internet. ???

nope , you are not on ban list nor your usual ip addresses .... just checked

must be at your end ( or your IPS)

regards
Z

I am finally back and I thank you for letting me know what went on. I just found out that form went down temporarilyi. I am so relief to be able to come back here and log in successfully.

These what if planes never flew because they sucked. If they were good, they would have been operational.

Why would we include phased out planes into the game? For a "what if" campaign? If WWII never ended in 45, then i would bet my life that their would be a whole new set of experimental planes and operational planes in the sky. Because that didnt happen, their is NO way you can predict what would have been made. Too many variables to consider.

These experimental planes are just that. Experiments. You do not buy a experiment for your house, you buy a tested and operational product. Same goes for aircraft.

That is not completely true, they experimented several aircrafts for different purposes. Not every experiment aircraft are craps. I would alway go for adding experimental and 'what if' aircraft to see how would they have affected the history of WWII campaign. And that is why I kept saying, we dont ever know how would have these experimental and 'what if' planes that didnt have a chance in WWII affect the war until they are used in WWII in simulator. Therefore giving it 'an alternative' history realistically.

There are so many of warplanes that have not ever been in service and now with the tools that are needed to find aerodynamic data exists out there now. Which is why I said, nothing is impossible and it is alway unwise to dismiss the chance to not to experience something unique virtually. This IL-2 simulator is one of perfect engine that would offer it.


Chaoic out...

[danger]

.... i really don't see why all this fuss , guys from AAA team will choose which project they prefer , anyway .
I hate to bring it out but decision what will get produced it's not really on community desires but rather on interests and willingness of modders ....it's only fair cos they are doing it in their own free time after all. :wink:

IMHO, any kind of pushing and lobbing would only produce contra effect ....

regards
Z
p.s.
please don't let this discussion to get out of hands

exactly.... that is why i have started the japanese planes myself :wink:

[Me262HG]

Impossible, evan in real life it would have not worked becuase the engine would not have been able to survive in the outer atmosthere.

[reflected]

Man, it's a bad joke, isn't it? We don't even have a Do-17, or a Defiant, or a Lancaster and you want to build SKUD missiles...why not F-14s?